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General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Should bring back diverse spellcaster level design.
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<blockquote data-quote="Fanaelialae" data-source="post: 8583384" data-attributes="member: 53980"><p>The bard doesn't necessarily lose out on 2nd level equivalents. They're simply crammed into either the spell level before or the spell level after (hopefully adjusted in power to match). </p><p></p><p>What you're proposing with the 5 spell levels is essentially cherry picking the best spell levels (ie, Shield, Fireball, Wall of Force, Forcecage, Wish) AND getting extra features on top of that to make up for the "lost" spells.</p><p></p><p></p><p>There is no formula for creating balanced spells. Designing balanced spells is as much an art as it is a science.</p><p></p><p>It has nothing to do with WotC's balancing metrics and everything to do with your idea. If you have fewer spell levels with respect to character levels, you end up with a design area that is much bigger (than if your spell levels correspond to character level). The existing 9 level spell progression only needs to account for two levels of character progression (and yet we still see significant variance among the spells therein). If we do as you suggest and have a 5 level spell progression, then each spell level needs to account for 4 character levels of progression, meaning that significantly greater variance is all but inevitable (you are starting from a less finely calibrated metric for the power level you are aiming for).</p><p></p><p></p><p>Making clerics half casters doesn't make them paladins, unless we assume that paladins are unchanged within this new paradigm (which is just silly). Paladins might lose casting altogether and entirely rely on (martially leaning) Thaumaturgy. Or, since paladins aren't explicitly servants of the divine in 5e, you could give them their own mechanics that are based around the swearing of oaths. Oath magic.</p><p></p><p>No, I wasn't referring to the Thaumaturgy cantrip (which had actually slipped my mind). I was speaking of hypothetical class features which I was tentatively referring to as Thaumaturgies.</p><p></p><p></p><p>That's an interesting observation regarding 3x3x3. I think you may well be correct. I wonder if, similarly, the reason that priests had 7 spell levels was due to religious associations with the number 7 (seven divine virtues, seven deadly sins, etc)?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Fanaelialae, post: 8583384, member: 53980"] The bard doesn't necessarily lose out on 2nd level equivalents. They're simply crammed into either the spell level before or the spell level after (hopefully adjusted in power to match). What you're proposing with the 5 spell levels is essentially cherry picking the best spell levels (ie, Shield, Fireball, Wall of Force, Forcecage, Wish) AND getting extra features on top of that to make up for the "lost" spells. There is no formula for creating balanced spells. Designing balanced spells is as much an art as it is a science. It has nothing to do with WotC's balancing metrics and everything to do with your idea. If you have fewer spell levels with respect to character levels, you end up with a design area that is much bigger (than if your spell levels correspond to character level). The existing 9 level spell progression only needs to account for two levels of character progression (and yet we still see significant variance among the spells therein). If we do as you suggest and have a 5 level spell progression, then each spell level needs to account for 4 character levels of progression, meaning that significantly greater variance is all but inevitable (you are starting from a less finely calibrated metric for the power level you are aiming for). Making clerics half casters doesn't make them paladins, unless we assume that paladins are unchanged within this new paradigm (which is just silly). Paladins might lose casting altogether and entirely rely on (martially leaning) Thaumaturgy. Or, since paladins aren't explicitly servants of the divine in 5e, you could give them their own mechanics that are based around the swearing of oaths. Oath magic. No, I wasn't referring to the Thaumaturgy cantrip (which had actually slipped my mind). I was speaking of hypothetical class features which I was tentatively referring to as Thaumaturgies. That's an interesting observation regarding 3x3x3. I think you may well be correct. I wonder if, similarly, the reason that priests had 7 spell levels was due to religious associations with the number 7 (seven divine virtues, seven deadly sins, etc)? [/QUOTE]
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Should bring back diverse spellcaster level design.
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