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General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions
So what do you guys think of 2nd edition psionics?
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<blockquote data-quote="Celebrim" data-source="post: 6539185" data-attributes="member: 4937"><p>When psionics became a term psuedo-science was under assault by more rigorous scientific methodology. If 'psionics' were to exist, the people advocating for them had to find gaps in the science into which they could fit. Many of the advocates were smart enough to realize that psychic powers - which they assumed were real - would obey things like conservation of energy. They assumed therefore that the psychic powers of the brain were grounded in physics but accessed technology that was presently poorly understood. The idea behind psionics is that once they figured out how psychic powers worked they would develop some sort of 'amplifiers' that would allow the weak powers of the mind to work more reliably and with greater effect or would actually replicate them with electronics - not minds that worked like electronics, but electronics that worked like minds. If you were to go to fringe occult places in the internet, you'd find discussions of just how to build such supposed devices.</p><p></p><p>That minds can accept and transmit radio waves are reasonable explanations for telepathic powers, assuming you believe such things exist. A psionic device would just amplify or augment these natural powers. You see this sort of explanation used in harder forms of science fiction such as for the telepathic dogs in 'A Fire Upon the Deep' (although in that story, it's ultrasound that is the telepathic medium) or the aforementioned telepathy corp in Gerrald's 'War against the Chtorr' books.</p><p></p><p>Early use of the term in science fiction tended to match this description. Gradually though, it just became a catch all term for 'magic' in a science fiction setting, usually with only the slightest grounding in any sort of technobabble (usually, if it has any explanation at all, it runs on Unobtanium). </p><p></p><p>There are a couple of things to keep in mind though. First, this is all just a theory to explain magic created by people who believed in magic and were trying to justify their belief. Mind reading, remote sensing, and moving things with your mind is just run of the mill traditional magic powers. Heck, even the thing with 'crystals as amplifiers' isn't really differentiation - what do you think a crystal ball is for?</p><p></p><p>Assuming that the magic of a wizard works, the question becomes, how does it work? Ancient magical traditions often assumed that magic was impossible for humans to perform - because well, people back then weren't stupid and this is pretty self-evidently true - and therefore that wizards worked magic by invoking or commanding helpful spirits who actually could do things people couldn't - for examples in literature, see Prospero in 'The Tempest'. That's a pretty reasonable and believable theory provided you believe in fairies. As scientific knowledge increased and science increased in stature, more and more magical traditions appear that give a different gloss to magic - as advanced science of some sort. D&D's wizards are actually of this later tradition. They don't rely on bound spirits or pacts with demons to influence the world. Instead, they have techniques for using mental discipline and focusing their will into specific acts of altering reality, which are mentally stored until ready to use. This is basically magic as 'sufficiently advanced technology'. Among other things, Vancian magic is explicitly magic of the far removed future. </p><p></p><p>There is therefore no real practical distinction from "magic that comes from study" and "magic that comes from your mind". Sure, you studied, but where is the power actually? Sure, it's from your mind, but what is the power actually? And this is particularly true when 'psion' becomes not something that you are born with, but another class that progresses and grows in power through experience, study, and repetition. The tropes of D&D psionics are largely drawn from the very same source material in late 19th century pseudo-science and magical traditions that are the source material for the D&D wizard. </p><p></p><p>Deprived of the idea of technological enablement, a psion is just a wizard and draws on the same power source(s) - a disciplined mind, esoteric lore, willpower, etc.</p><p></p><p>Or put it this way, if a psion uses the 'power of his mind', what exactly is the nature of this power? What substance does it have? It's magic.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Celebrim, post: 6539185, member: 4937"] When psionics became a term psuedo-science was under assault by more rigorous scientific methodology. If 'psionics' were to exist, the people advocating for them had to find gaps in the science into which they could fit. Many of the advocates were smart enough to realize that psychic powers - which they assumed were real - would obey things like conservation of energy. They assumed therefore that the psychic powers of the brain were grounded in physics but accessed technology that was presently poorly understood. The idea behind psionics is that once they figured out how psychic powers worked they would develop some sort of 'amplifiers' that would allow the weak powers of the mind to work more reliably and with greater effect or would actually replicate them with electronics - not minds that worked like electronics, but electronics that worked like minds. If you were to go to fringe occult places in the internet, you'd find discussions of just how to build such supposed devices. That minds can accept and transmit radio waves are reasonable explanations for telepathic powers, assuming you believe such things exist. A psionic device would just amplify or augment these natural powers. You see this sort of explanation used in harder forms of science fiction such as for the telepathic dogs in 'A Fire Upon the Deep' (although in that story, it's ultrasound that is the telepathic medium) or the aforementioned telepathy corp in Gerrald's 'War against the Chtorr' books. Early use of the term in science fiction tended to match this description. Gradually though, it just became a catch all term for 'magic' in a science fiction setting, usually with only the slightest grounding in any sort of technobabble (usually, if it has any explanation at all, it runs on Unobtanium). There are a couple of things to keep in mind though. First, this is all just a theory to explain magic created by people who believed in magic and were trying to justify their belief. Mind reading, remote sensing, and moving things with your mind is just run of the mill traditional magic powers. Heck, even the thing with 'crystals as amplifiers' isn't really differentiation - what do you think a crystal ball is for? Assuming that the magic of a wizard works, the question becomes, how does it work? Ancient magical traditions often assumed that magic was impossible for humans to perform - because well, people back then weren't stupid and this is pretty self-evidently true - and therefore that wizards worked magic by invoking or commanding helpful spirits who actually could do things people couldn't - for examples in literature, see Prospero in 'The Tempest'. That's a pretty reasonable and believable theory provided you believe in fairies. As scientific knowledge increased and science increased in stature, more and more magical traditions appear that give a different gloss to magic - as advanced science of some sort. D&D's wizards are actually of this later tradition. They don't rely on bound spirits or pacts with demons to influence the world. Instead, they have techniques for using mental discipline and focusing their will into specific acts of altering reality, which are mentally stored until ready to use. This is basically magic as 'sufficiently advanced technology'. Among other things, Vancian magic is explicitly magic of the far removed future. There is therefore no real practical distinction from "magic that comes from study" and "magic that comes from your mind". Sure, you studied, but where is the power actually? Sure, it's from your mind, but what is the power actually? And this is particularly true when 'psion' becomes not something that you are born with, but another class that progresses and grows in power through experience, study, and repetition. The tropes of D&D psionics are largely drawn from the very same source material in late 19th century pseudo-science and magical traditions that are the source material for the D&D wizard. Deprived of the idea of technological enablement, a psion is just a wizard and draws on the same power source(s) - a disciplined mind, esoteric lore, willpower, etc. Or put it this way, if a psion uses the 'power of his mind', what exactly is the nature of this power? What substance does it have? It's magic. [/QUOTE]
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