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<blockquote data-quote="DND_Reborn" data-source="post: 8638093" data-attributes="member: 6987520"><p>Some benefits I certain agree with. Others I think should be added but in a more gradual manner to represent the PC getting better. For instance, consider Extra Attack. At 4th level, you can attack once, but suddenly at 5th, you can attack twice, which is a huge jump in effectiveness in combat!</p><p></p><p>So, I prefer a slow approach--- you can Extra Attack at level 1, but with a -8 penalty on both attacks. You are trying to do too much and not experienced enough to do it well. Each level the penalty decreased by 2, so -6 @ 2nd, -4 @ 3rd, and -2 @ 4th. Then, finally, at 5th level, the penalty is gone. There is no need to <em>train</em> for this as you've been attacking the entire time during your adventures.</p><p></p><p>Now, with cantrip damage, it might be possible to train to unlock the secrets of more powerful magic, so that would make more sense to me personally.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Glad to. Yes, I see leveling in game time happening quickly, usually over a matter of a few weeks (or even a few days at lower levels!). As the levels get higher, the challenges offer more XP so the pace does not slow down very much--but a little bit, yes.</p><p></p><p>For example, going from 1st to 4th level in game time might take less than one month, sometimes less. So, if the ASI is used for ability improvements, it is a short time for such a big change (going from STR 16 to 18, for instance). Now, others might not see the increase as big as I do, so don't see it as an issue. Another option would be to force the ASI into two abilities, which would not be as big a deal, but might not sit well with players.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Probably not since it would just double the base time required, but if someone wants training to take longer you could certainly do it.</p><p></p><p></p><p>That's cool that you feel that way. I would be all for not including them at all, either, except I know you <em>CAN</em> improve yourself IRL and I would want PCs to be able to do that if they devote the time to it.</p><p></p><p>The <em>chance</em> element for failure is meant to represent the concept of diminishing returns. When you work out, for instance, you can see pretty good gains quickly. But to reach higher and higher levels of fitness, it takes more and more time and effort, and eventually you reach a point where you just can't go any further. That is what the third failure would represent--you have reached your maximum potential and cannot go higher.</p><p></p><p>Perhaps instead of not allowing improvement at that point, make any further attempts with disadvantage. You can still keep trying, but it is just that much harder once you've peaked.</p><p></p><p>Otherwise, having arrays based on power-level for the game is a good idea, if you don't want to have them gradually increase or improve through training.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="DND_Reborn, post: 8638093, member: 6987520"] Some benefits I certain agree with. Others I think should be added but in a more gradual manner to represent the PC getting better. For instance, consider Extra Attack. At 4th level, you can attack once, but suddenly at 5th, you can attack twice, which is a huge jump in effectiveness in combat! So, I prefer a slow approach--- you can Extra Attack at level 1, but with a -8 penalty on both attacks. You are trying to do too much and not experienced enough to do it well. Each level the penalty decreased by 2, so -6 @ 2nd, -4 @ 3rd, and -2 @ 4th. Then, finally, at 5th level, the penalty is gone. There is no need to [I]train[/I] for this as you've been attacking the entire time during your adventures. Now, with cantrip damage, it might be possible to train to unlock the secrets of more powerful magic, so that would make more sense to me personally. Glad to. Yes, I see leveling in game time happening quickly, usually over a matter of a few weeks (or even a few days at lower levels!). As the levels get higher, the challenges offer more XP so the pace does not slow down very much--but a little bit, yes. For example, going from 1st to 4th level in game time might take less than one month, sometimes less. So, if the ASI is used for ability improvements, it is a short time for such a big change (going from STR 16 to 18, for instance). Now, others might not see the increase as big as I do, so don't see it as an issue. Another option would be to force the ASI into two abilities, which would not be as big a deal, but might not sit well with players. Probably not since it would just double the base time required, but if someone wants training to take longer you could certainly do it. That's cool that you feel that way. I would be all for not including them at all, either, except I know you [I]CAN[/I] improve yourself IRL and I would want PCs to be able to do that if they devote the time to it. The [I]chance[/I] element for failure is meant to represent the concept of diminishing returns. When you work out, for instance, you can see pretty good gains quickly. But to reach higher and higher levels of fitness, it takes more and more time and effort, and eventually you reach a point where you just can't go any further. That is what the third failure would represent--you have reached your maximum potential and cannot go higher. Perhaps instead of not allowing improvement at that point, make any further attempts with disadvantage. You can still keep trying, but it is just that much harder once you've peaked. Otherwise, having arrays based on power-level for the game is a good idea, if you don't want to have them gradually increase or improve through training. [/QUOTE]
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