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<blockquote data-quote="Veep" data-source="post: 6743789" data-attributes="member: 6793297"><p><strong>Originally posted by era:</strong></p><p></p><p>General Discussion</p><p></p><p>[sblock <strong>Why play a pacifist cleric?</strong>]Firstly I want to point out that a pacifist cleric is not right for every group, but this is true of any specialized build. There are however some situations in which a pacifist healer can really shine above other possible candidates for the role.</p><p></p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Your Dungeon Master is a known player/party killer. We all know the type, they think they aren't doing their job if the lives of some or all of the party members aren't constantly in peril. By playing a pacifist cleric you make it almost impossible for any of your party members to die, and if the DM really wants someone to die, it'll be over your dead body. In this case your defenses and your ability to self heal become quite important.<br /> </li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">You are playing in a larger party and no one else wants to play a leader. In a party of six or more, having a single leader that is able to provide enough healing to keep the entire party going means that another player is free to play a striker, defender, or controller, instead of a leader. If you are playing a pacifist in a smaller party (four-five) and you find you have excess healing, then you might want to select some more damage dealing powers to use early in encounters against unbloodied enemies. If you are the only healer in the party then it is important that your party members have some way to heal you if you fall unconscious, either with potions or with a multi-class feat that gives them a healing power.<br /> </li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">You want to play a highly optimized character, but don't want to ruin the fun for a group of more causal players. It can be quite disheartening for a group of players when the highly optimized wizard is consistently putting out loads more damage than the normally built strikers. An optimized striker can be even worse, entirely stealing the lime light from the rest of the players. If you enjoy optimizing your character, but don't want to ruin your friends enjoyment, then you might want to consider playing a pacifist cleric. The better you are at your job, the more fun the rest of the party will have. It's a win-win situation.<br /> </li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">You want a relatively simple character to play who has quick turns and keeps the speed of battle up. Paradoxically, I believe, a pacifist cleric can actually speed battles up. Most of your turns will consist of quickly working out what target should die next, putting astral seal on it, asking if anyone is badly bloodied, sustaining any powers, and ending your turn. In my games my turns are consistently the shortest, thus speeding up combat.<br /> </li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Related to the last point, simple and quick characters are ideal for newer players who don't want to, or aren't able to, get their head around complicated powers, rules, and tactics.[/sblock]<br /> </li> </ul><p></p><p>[sblock <strong>Note to Role-Players</strong>]Role-playing a pacifist cleric in the world of dungeons and dragons can present some dilemmas. Why is it okay to directly damage unbloodied creatures, but not bloodied ones? Why is it okay to indirectly damage any creature at all? Why is it okay to kill minions? Why is it okay to directly assist your party in killing creatures? Why would a pacifist even want to be part of a party that kills creatures on an almost daily basis?</p><p></p><p>This is where role playing can really begin to shine, your character by its very nature begs to be given an interesting personality and back-story to justify it at all. What follows are some possible ideas to help you think of interesting ways to resolve some of the dilemmas. Most importantly, talk with your DM and fellow players. Ask them to help create a plot line with hooks that would still motivate your character to join the party. Remember, the greater good can motivate a lot of small indiscretion. If the world is going to end unless your party succeeds, then you have a strong motivation to assist them even if thier means aren't always agreeable to you.</p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Refluff the pacifist feat. Perhaps your character just has a very a weak stomach. Think of a vegetarian who doesn't eat meat just because they think it is gross. This isn't really moral reasoning, but it comes to the same thing in action. Such vegetarians are normally happy for their friends to do gross things, they just can't stomach doing it themselves. With this fluff, it would be the fact that an enemy is covered in blood that makes you queasy, and thus make you feel stunned for making them bleed even more. On the flip side, you'll be extra good at closing those wounds up.<br /> </li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Perhaps your character is stuck with a pacifist vow that they no longer strongly believe in. For instance, I roleplay my Kalashtar as inhabiting the body of an old pacifist grandma, he is stuck with her vow, but actively pursues adventures with pretty much the same mindset as any normal character.<br /> </li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">You can have your character make a strong distinction between offense and defense. You might strongly believe it is wrong to harm another being, except in self-defense. I use consecrated ground in this way; "This is my space, leave me alone! If you come too close you'll get hurt for your trouble."<br /> </li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">You can describe your debuffs as encouragements for the enemies to surrender and lay down their arms.<br /> </li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Even in most historical nonviolent movements there has still been a strong dose of active action. Real pacifists don't just sit at home, they actively go out into the world to try to improve it, often getting themselves involved in violent situations.<br /> </li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Try to temper your parties behavior. In fact it makes sense that a pacifist would hang out with the most violent people, because that is where they can be most effective at making the world a better place.<br /> </li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">You might be a captive of your party, maybe they have some leverage over you, in which case you'd be forced to help them least they hurt the people you care about.[/sblock]<br /> </li> </ul><p></p><p>[sblock <strong>Note to Party Members</strong>][/sblock]</p><p>[sblock <strong>Note to Dungeon Masters</strong>][/sblock]</p><p>[sblock <strong>Note to Devs</strong>]Please don't nerf us again.[/sblock]</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Veep, post: 6743789, member: 6793297"] [b]Originally posted by era:[/b] General Discussion [sblock [b]Why play a pacifist cleric?[/b]]Firstly I want to point out that a pacifist cleric is not right for every group, but this is true of any specialized build. There are however some situations in which a pacifist healer can really shine above other possible candidates for the role. [LIST][*]Your Dungeon Master is a known player/party killer. We all know the type, they think they aren't doing their job if the lives of some or all of the party members aren't constantly in peril. By playing a pacifist cleric you make it almost impossible for any of your party members to die, and if the DM really wants someone to die, it'll be over your dead body. In this case your defenses and your ability to self heal become quite important. [*]You are playing in a larger party and no one else wants to play a leader. In a party of six or more, having a single leader that is able to provide enough healing to keep the entire party going means that another player is free to play a striker, defender, or controller, instead of a leader. If you are playing a pacifist in a smaller party (four-five) and you find you have excess healing, then you might want to select some more damage dealing powers to use early in encounters against unbloodied enemies. If you are the only healer in the party then it is important that your party members have some way to heal you if you fall unconscious, either with potions or with a multi-class feat that gives them a healing power. [*]You want to play a highly optimized character, but don't want to ruin the fun for a group of more causal players. It can be quite disheartening for a group of players when the highly optimized wizard is consistently putting out loads more damage than the normally built strikers. An optimized striker can be even worse, entirely stealing the lime light from the rest of the players. If you enjoy optimizing your character, but don't want to ruin your friends enjoyment, then you might want to consider playing a pacifist cleric. The better you are at your job, the more fun the rest of the party will have. It's a win-win situation. [*]You want a relatively simple character to play who has quick turns and keeps the speed of battle up. Paradoxically, I believe, a pacifist cleric can actually speed battles up. Most of your turns will consist of quickly working out what target should die next, putting astral seal on it, asking if anyone is badly bloodied, sustaining any powers, and ending your turn. In my games my turns are consistently the shortest, thus speeding up combat. [*]Related to the last point, simple and quick characters are ideal for newer players who don't want to, or aren't able to, get their head around complicated powers, rules, and tactics.[/sblock] [/LIST] [sblock [b]Note to Role-Players[/b]]Role-playing a pacifist cleric in the world of dungeons and dragons can present some dilemmas. Why is it okay to directly damage unbloodied creatures, but not bloodied ones? Why is it okay to indirectly damage any creature at all? Why is it okay to kill minions? Why is it okay to directly assist your party in killing creatures? Why would a pacifist even want to be part of a party that kills creatures on an almost daily basis? This is where role playing can really begin to shine, your character by its very nature begs to be given an interesting personality and back-story to justify it at all. What follows are some possible ideas to help you think of interesting ways to resolve some of the dilemmas. Most importantly, talk with your DM and fellow players. Ask them to help create a plot line with hooks that would still motivate your character to join the party. Remember, the greater good can motivate a lot of small indiscretion. If the world is going to end unless your party succeeds, then you have a strong motivation to assist them even if thier means aren't always agreeable to you. [LIST][*]Refluff the pacifist feat. Perhaps your character just has a very a weak stomach. Think of a vegetarian who doesn't eat meat just because they think it is gross. This isn't really moral reasoning, but it comes to the same thing in action. Such vegetarians are normally happy for their friends to do gross things, they just can't stomach doing it themselves. With this fluff, it would be the fact that an enemy is covered in blood that makes you queasy, and thus make you feel stunned for making them bleed even more. On the flip side, you'll be extra good at closing those wounds up. [*]Perhaps your character is stuck with a pacifist vow that they no longer strongly believe in. For instance, I roleplay my Kalashtar as inhabiting the body of an old pacifist grandma, he is stuck with her vow, but actively pursues adventures with pretty much the same mindset as any normal character. [*]You can have your character make a strong distinction between offense and defense. You might strongly believe it is wrong to harm another being, except in self-defense. I use consecrated ground in this way; "This is my space, leave me alone! If you come too close you'll get hurt for your trouble." [*]You can describe your debuffs as encouragements for the enemies to surrender and lay down their arms. [*]Even in most historical nonviolent movements there has still been a strong dose of active action. Real pacifists don't just sit at home, they actively go out into the world to try to improve it, often getting themselves involved in violent situations. [*]Try to temper your parties behavior. In fact it makes sense that a pacifist would hang out with the most violent people, because that is where they can be most effective at making the world a better place. [*]You might be a captive of your party, maybe they have some leverage over you, in which case you'd be forced to help them least they hurt the people you care about.[/sblock] [/LIST] [sblock [b]Note to Party Members[/b]][/sblock] [sblock [b]Note to Dungeon Masters[/b]][/sblock] [sblock [b]Note to Devs[/b]]Please don't nerf us again.[/sblock] [/QUOTE]
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