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<blockquote data-quote="PMárk" data-source="post: 7687285" data-attributes="member: 6804619"><p>Pretty much all of this and, well, everything else that is in the core class features in the PHB. I get it, for a lot of people, proficiency in certain skills is covering the wilderness part of the class, but please understand, that to a lot of other people (including me) the extra features the ranger gets ont the top of that base is essential. It's not perfect, I could imagine stronger, or more flexible versions, but it is OK. </p><p></p><p> The fighter's theme is fighting and it allows a lot of sub-themes, like manouvers, hitting very hard, organizing the fight and so on. I think the ranger is also a fine class, which theme is (saving people) hunting things and survival with also a lot of possibble themes, like: hunting down things like no one else, scouting-skirmishing, bonding with pets, hunting related spells etc. All of them are viable approaches as subclasses in my eyes and the sum of that absolutely deserves a full class. </p><p></p><p> In one sense, everything is everything as classes are artificial. A scout is a nature rogue? Sure, and the rogue is just an urban scout. Barbarians are just rangers focusing on fighting and tapping their inner bestial self. I think everything that is nature-hunting-fighting related is fundamentaly in the ranger "familiy". However, I'm okay with some oddities, like the nature paladin, and a possible scout-rogue. Why not? Allowing interesting concepts is always better than restricting.</p><p></p><p>As a related topic: I was a litle bit disappointed, that the bladesinger became a wizard subclass, I loved the Pathfinder MAGUS and it's archetypes but hey, the BS is good after all, so it's not a tragedy. <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite1" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":)" /></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="PMárk, post: 7687285, member: 6804619"] Pretty much all of this and, well, everything else that is in the core class features in the PHB. I get it, for a lot of people, proficiency in certain skills is covering the wilderness part of the class, but please understand, that to a lot of other people (including me) the extra features the ranger gets ont the top of that base is essential. It's not perfect, I could imagine stronger, or more flexible versions, but it is OK. The fighter's theme is fighting and it allows a lot of sub-themes, like manouvers, hitting very hard, organizing the fight and so on. I think the ranger is also a fine class, which theme is (saving people) hunting things and survival with also a lot of possibble themes, like: hunting down things like no one else, scouting-skirmishing, bonding with pets, hunting related spells etc. All of them are viable approaches as subclasses in my eyes and the sum of that absolutely deserves a full class. In one sense, everything is everything as classes are artificial. A scout is a nature rogue? Sure, and the rogue is just an urban scout. Barbarians are just rangers focusing on fighting and tapping their inner bestial self. I think everything that is nature-hunting-fighting related is fundamentaly in the ranger "familiy". However, I'm okay with some oddities, like the nature paladin, and a possible scout-rogue. Why not? Allowing interesting concepts is always better than restricting. As a related topic: I was a litle bit disappointed, that the bladesinger became a wizard subclass, I loved the Pathfinder MAGUS and it's archetypes but hey, the BS is good after all, so it's not a tragedy. :) [/QUOTE]
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