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General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Tactical Narrative Combat Modules in D&D Next
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<blockquote data-quote="Mustrum_Ridcully" data-source="post: 5959000" data-attributes="member: 710"><p>Well, that's already thinking very much about "simulation" issues. I am not necessarily against it, but I think on some level, what is also very important is that these options are balanced. That means, they must have a certain degree of "usefulness" - not too little that no one takes them, and not too much so you'll always take them. And this type of balance is really hard to find if you do something abstract like "take a penalty but do it as often as you like (meaning: until someone runs out of hit points)"</p><p></p><p>Think of 3E D&D Trip and Improved Trip. Without the feat, it was way too costly. Attack of Opportunity, chance to get counter-tripped. Not worth the effort. (Also, very complex to resolve). But if you had the right feats and equipment, well, there was no reason not to use your second or third iterative attack on a trip! You would get the enemy prone giving you a +4 to attack, unless he spends a move action to stand up and takes an AoO for it (with that +4 to attack). It's a great lockdown "power".</p><p></p><p>4E went another route - no spamming such strong maneuvers - instead, you can use such a maneuver once per encounter or combat. That made balancing it easier - it had to compete with other limited use powers and you just had to set some sensible power level for those and know that no one could do them more often than once each in a combat. </p><p></p><p></p><p>But critical hits are random. You can go an entire evening without them. There is no way for the player or the character to decide to try some combat maneuver. That doesn't really seem to make much sense, and it's also a lot less fun then when you see a situation "it would be really good if I could disarm that guy that is wielding that Vorpal Sword before anyone loses his head"</p><p> </p><p></p><p>You mean the at-will attacks? I can see what you mean, but I think it made combat more interesting (but also more complex) from round to round. If you want a simple and fast, gridless combat as core rule, it's probably not a good idea (regardless of whether you find it cool or uncool - I can only say I liked it.).</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Mustrum_Ridcully, post: 5959000, member: 710"] Well, that's already thinking very much about "simulation" issues. I am not necessarily against it, but I think on some level, what is also very important is that these options are balanced. That means, they must have a certain degree of "usefulness" - not too little that no one takes them, and not too much so you'll always take them. And this type of balance is really hard to find if you do something abstract like "take a penalty but do it as often as you like (meaning: until someone runs out of hit points)" Think of 3E D&D Trip and Improved Trip. Without the feat, it was way too costly. Attack of Opportunity, chance to get counter-tripped. Not worth the effort. (Also, very complex to resolve). But if you had the right feats and equipment, well, there was no reason not to use your second or third iterative attack on a trip! You would get the enemy prone giving you a +4 to attack, unless he spends a move action to stand up and takes an AoO for it (with that +4 to attack). It's a great lockdown "power". 4E went another route - no spamming such strong maneuvers - instead, you can use such a maneuver once per encounter or combat. That made balancing it easier - it had to compete with other limited use powers and you just had to set some sensible power level for those and know that no one could do them more often than once each in a combat. But critical hits are random. You can go an entire evening without them. There is no way for the player or the character to decide to try some combat maneuver. That doesn't really seem to make much sense, and it's also a lot less fun then when you see a situation "it would be really good if I could disarm that guy that is wielding that Vorpal Sword before anyone loses his head" You mean the at-will attacks? I can see what you mean, but I think it made combat more interesting (but also more complex) from round to round. If you want a simple and fast, gridless combat as core rule, it's probably not a good idea (regardless of whether you find it cool or uncool - I can only say I liked it.). [/QUOTE]
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