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Taking20's Illusion of Choice - Breaking it Down
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<blockquote data-quote="!DWolf" data-source="post: 8158491" data-attributes="member: 7026314"><p>Turning into a fly and spying on people might be creative but it is not an encounter by pf2s definition (time is precisely measured in six second increments). Look at the encounter examples he actually gave: a chimera in a mountain pass, a mimic in a room, ghouls and ghasts somewhere, and wights attacking a fighter and ranger. In all these he has assumed what happens is the exactly same - the monster shows up and attacks until defeated. His players fall into ‘optimal’ routines because he is presenting them (in combat) with variations of the same scenario over and over again and they have optimized for it. The fact that he blames the system for him doing that and the subsequent effects on his game (characters falling into ‘optimal routines’) is why people are calling him out. </p><p></p><p>Side Note: you can tell that he has assumed straight combat because he says the optimal routine problem is exemplified by these scenarios: but as soon as you change them to be something other than straight combat, then the ‘optimal’ routine problem is revealed to be a lie. Take the ranger in the chimera example: the rangers ‘optimal’ routine (hunt prey and then make attacks until target is dead) completely breaks down if the chimera is performing a hit-and-run over hostile terrain and ends each turn with no line of effect to the party and obstacles and hazards between them. Likewise if the ghoul and ghast encounter is an infinite number of ghouls and ghast emerging from a set of submerged tunnels in a vertical cave system that is rapidly flooding with water (because it’s raining), then the rangers ‘optimal’ action is probably not going to be hunt prey, shoot target until dead.</p><p></p><p>Further note: I am running pregens through my death traps. Neither the ranger Harsk nor the swashbuckler Jirelle seem to have ‘optimal’ routines that it appears they must do every turn to be effective. Quite the opposite - they have a wide variety of equally viable actions that they are forced to choose between such that even I, who have perfect information about the situation, finds it impossible to choose the ‘optimal’ action.</p><p></p><p>Right and if he had just said that everyone would have just shrugged and moved on. But he instead blamed the system for a problem he created and then got super defensive about it when people pointed that out.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="!DWolf, post: 8158491, member: 7026314"] Turning into a fly and spying on people might be creative but it is not an encounter by pf2s definition (time is precisely measured in six second increments). Look at the encounter examples he actually gave: a chimera in a mountain pass, a mimic in a room, ghouls and ghasts somewhere, and wights attacking a fighter and ranger. In all these he has assumed what happens is the exactly same - the monster shows up and attacks until defeated. His players fall into ‘optimal’ routines because he is presenting them (in combat) with variations of the same scenario over and over again and they have optimized for it. The fact that he blames the system for him doing that and the subsequent effects on his game (characters falling into ‘optimal routines’) is why people are calling him out. Side Note: you can tell that he has assumed straight combat because he says the optimal routine problem is exemplified by these scenarios: but as soon as you change them to be something other than straight combat, then the ‘optimal’ routine problem is revealed to be a lie. Take the ranger in the chimera example: the rangers ‘optimal’ routine (hunt prey and then make attacks until target is dead) completely breaks down if the chimera is performing a hit-and-run over hostile terrain and ends each turn with no line of effect to the party and obstacles and hazards between them. Likewise if the ghoul and ghast encounter is an infinite number of ghouls and ghast emerging from a set of submerged tunnels in a vertical cave system that is rapidly flooding with water (because it’s raining), then the rangers ‘optimal’ action is probably not going to be hunt prey, shoot target until dead. Further note: I am running pregens through my death traps. Neither the ranger Harsk nor the swashbuckler Jirelle seem to have ‘optimal’ routines that it appears they must do every turn to be effective. Quite the opposite - they have a wide variety of equally viable actions that they are forced to choose between such that even I, who have perfect information about the situation, finds it impossible to choose the ‘optimal’ action. Right and if he had just said that everyone would have just shrugged and moved on. But he instead blamed the system for a problem he created and then got super defensive about it when people pointed that out. [/QUOTE]
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