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Teleport /fly /misty step the bane of cool dungeon design is RAW in 5E
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<blockquote data-quote="Waterbizkit" data-source="post: 7223721" data-attributes="member: 6802604"><p>This is actually a great example of different strokes for different folks, with no one way being better than the other. And to be clear, I'm not implying you were passing judgement on how others play the game. <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite1" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":)" /></p><p></p><p>But anyway, looking at your slippery wall example and speaking only for myself, I'm indifferent about which way the party gets around it. What's lost if party uses transportation magic to get over the wall? A few athletics checks? I don't personally feel that's a loss at all and I don't design dungeons that hinge on the players <em>having</em> to make those checks in order for it to be fun for them or myself. Besides, party composition aside, what would the party do if they didn't levitate or fly up the wall to spike the rope? Oh yeah, send the person with the best athletics skill to climb the wall and spike the rope, making the check nothing but a formality in most cases.</p><p></p><p>The gate example is a better one, especially if opening the gate involved designing a puzzle for the players and all they do is bampf through it. That can be frustrating. But again, if I want the players to engage with an obstacle I'll take their abilities into account. Some DMs might find that a bit "meta", but used every now and again I don't think it's a bad thing to do, even if I do try to design my dungeons from the perspective of the <em>world</em> it exists in rather than as an exercise in challenging the players.</p><p></p><p>Anyway, to the thread subject as a whole, I've never had anything I've designed hinge on the characters being held up by a pit, a wall, or some other obstacle. For me that's not the kind of thing that makes or breaks my game, so if the characters use their resources to sidestep these things instead of engaging them, I'm fine with that. Hell, I'm fine with them <em>not</em> expending resources to sidestep this stuff... I happily allow Aarakocra or other races with innate flight or teleportation abilities in my game, I just don't mind it. But! That's me. I get why some people want these things to be a bigger challenge and there's a lot of ways, as others have already pointed out, to do this.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Waterbizkit, post: 7223721, member: 6802604"] This is actually a great example of different strokes for different folks, with no one way being better than the other. And to be clear, I'm not implying you were passing judgement on how others play the game. :) But anyway, looking at your slippery wall example and speaking only for myself, I'm indifferent about which way the party gets around it. What's lost if party uses transportation magic to get over the wall? A few athletics checks? I don't personally feel that's a loss at all and I don't design dungeons that hinge on the players [i]having[/i] to make those checks in order for it to be fun for them or myself. Besides, party composition aside, what would the party do if they didn't levitate or fly up the wall to spike the rope? Oh yeah, send the person with the best athletics skill to climb the wall and spike the rope, making the check nothing but a formality in most cases. The gate example is a better one, especially if opening the gate involved designing a puzzle for the players and all they do is bampf through it. That can be frustrating. But again, if I want the players to engage with an obstacle I'll take their abilities into account. Some DMs might find that a bit "meta", but used every now and again I don't think it's a bad thing to do, even if I do try to design my dungeons from the perspective of the [i]world[/i] it exists in rather than as an exercise in challenging the players. Anyway, to the thread subject as a whole, I've never had anything I've designed hinge on the characters being held up by a pit, a wall, or some other obstacle. For me that's not the kind of thing that makes or breaks my game, so if the characters use their resources to sidestep these things instead of engaging them, I'm fine with that. Hell, I'm fine with them [i]not[/i] expending resources to sidestep this stuff... I happily allow Aarakocra or other races with innate flight or teleportation abilities in my game, I just don't mind it. But! That's me. I get why some people want these things to be a bigger challenge and there's a lot of ways, as others have already pointed out, to do this. [/QUOTE]
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