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<blockquote data-quote="innerdude" data-source="post: 6212597" data-attributes="member: 85870"><p>Strengths:</p><p></p><p></p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Once you're over the initial learning curve for the system, a GM with nearly any level of system mastery can prep an entire session in 10 minutes. This is not an exaggeration. It's that easy to set up encounters.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">As a result, as a GM you can spend nearly all your time setting up plots, and hooks, and stories, and scenarios, and locations, and maps, and just generally doing the "fun stuff" of being GM.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Combats are active, engaging, and require good teamwork. There's lots of "setting up your buddy" to make a wicked-good hit using tactics. Plus, characters with any fighting ability are automatically assumed to be able to do most maneuvers. There's no "feat tax" to be able to grapple, or trip. Typically it's just an opposed roll of some kind.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Tricks and Tests of Will make it possible for someone who's not specialized in combat to contribute to combats, and have a distinct effect on the outcome.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">While the wound system isn't perfect IMHO, it's still overall a step up for me from D&D-style hitpoints. Why? <em>Because combat is always taken at least somewhat seriously. </em>There's no heavily armored fighters running around in battle with archers and crossbowman everywhere saying, "Oh, I'll just eat that 1d8 damage attack. BWAHAHAH!" In the wrong circumstances, a single PC facing two or three low-level crossbowmen will think twice before doing anything stupid. While the exploding dice mechanic nearly always plays into the PC's favor, it still only takes one lucky hit from a mook with a sword, and your character can be in a world of hurt.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Speaking of exploding dice, they're just flat out awesome. Yeah, it sometimes makes stuff really "swingy" and a little random. To me this is clearly a feature and not a bug. It makes the tighter damage modeling of 3e, and especially 4e, feel a bit too predictable, even a little uninspired.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Literally every single character I've ever seen played in my games, from fantasy to modern spy / military, has been useful. There simply are no dead-weight characters. Every character contributes, every character gets to play fun situational tactics.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">This is more of a personal preference, but Savage Worlds plays right into the types of combats I like to run---lots of "human" foes of varying skills and tactical awareness. I rarely liked D&D's typical "CR 20 Giant Slavering Muncha-muncha of Demonoid heritage." I like my campaigns to be "human"-centric. Campaigns are interesting because of character and NPC motivations, not because the characters got to go plane hopping and "pown" a Tanar'ri.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">That said, with the right system knowledge, and a little bit of tweaking, it's easy to set up "boss monster" foes that are fun and challenging.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">In the same vein, combats can support virtually any terrain or interesting "spacing" you can imagine. Fire pits? Narrow rope bridges? Crumbling stone walls? Bring it on! And don't forget to let your players know what's actually in the room---pots, glasses, broken bottles, a chair leg, a roll of cloth or burlap. A creative player can use all of these to devastating effect with fighting "tricks."</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">As easy as the core system is to "grok," it's pretty difficult for players to go on total "autopilot." It's hard to explain, other than in my experience, players are consistently asked to engage with what's happening in the game world. The fact that every combat can pose a real threat, and every GM hook can be pursued without fear of going someplace "unprepared," means as a GM you can totally mold the narrative to what the characters want. It's almost impossible to NOT make the characters the heroes of the story, because it's so easy to give them what they want, when they want it.</li> </ul><p></p><p>Weaknesses: </p><p></p><p></p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">The wound mechanic isn't for everyone. It's a mechanic that makes no bones about the fact that in a lot of ways, it's a purely metagame concept. Some players find it disheartening when they think, "Yeah, I totally destroyed that guy!" only to have the foe get a raise on their soak roll and negate the damage. My players are very good with this though, in that they understand what the system is emulating (a simplified hitpoint system)---but it also makes those hits that do finally score real damage that much more satisfying.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">There are no "throw away" combats. Every combat has the potential, with some good/bad luck on the GM's dice, to cripple the party. If you're looking for a game where players can just have a "casual" combat every session, just to get their kicks out of some combat tactics, it's tough to do that without making the combat a total pushover.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">The hardest part as a fledgling GM is figuring out how to balance encounters. There's really no guidelines, and it really does take 2-5 combats as a GM before you really start to get a feel for what your characters are capable of. Once you sort of understand the basics (3 mooks = 1 "Wild Card" character), it gets a little easier. Furthermore, there's lots of help on the forums with encounter setup.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">I don't personally find this a weakness, but some do---the power curve for Savage Worlds PCs is very tight. It's the equivalent of D&D PCs progressing from levels 2-9, or maybe 3-10. Players looking for the "epic," super-gonzo feel of high-level D&D are going to be disappointed. Personally, I love this, but be aware it is what it is.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">There's absolutely nothing wrong with Savage's out-of-the-box magic rules, they're just far from the highlight of the system. They're merely good, or adequate, though if you're sick of high-powered D&D magic-user nonsense, this might be a welcome change. Otherwise, if you have players that REALLY want to be the "Mage of mages," Savage probably isn't a great fit.</li> </ul><p></p><p>Genres: </p><p></p><p>I personally have run a "classic" fantasy campaign (FANTASTIC!), a paramilitary / covert ops modern day campaign (pretty good, could have been better because I know the system better now), and a Serenity / Firefly campaign (great system for this world). Savage Worlds handled all of these genres with aplomb. </p><p></p><p>I'm itching to try a Star Wars campaign with it, a cyberpunk campaign using the Interface Zero campaign setting, a "Pirates of the Caribbean" campaign using 50 Fathoms and / or Pirates of the Spanish Main, and Weird Wars Rome.</p><p></p><p>Genres I think Savage Worlds would handle extremely well:</p><p></p><p></p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Classic fantasy</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">James Bond-style spy thriller</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Urban fantasy, in a multitude of time periods (modern, Victorian, etc.)</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">"Kinetic" cyberpunk (think the old '90s movie <em>Strange Days </em>and not <em>Blade Runner</em>)</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">"Pulp" Sci-fi</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Really pretty much any sci-fi that avoids more "hard tech" tropes</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Any Age of Sails / Victorian era settings</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">With the right sanity mechanic (see <em>Realms of Cthulu</em>), a Cthulu-style game.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Pulp to semi-gritty "film noir." I haven't purchased it yet, but everything I've ever seen about Deadlands: Noir makes it seem like a truly fantastic setting.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Western</li> </ul><p></p><p></p><p>Genres for which I think Savage Worlds would not be the best choice: </p><p></p><p></p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">"Hard" sci-fi</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">High-powered superheroes. It MIGHT be okay doing a somewhat low-powered, X-Men-ish style, but certainly not Green Lantern / Superman. If you hunt the Web, this is a fairly common comment about the system in general.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Hard-core mystery / investigation campaigns (though someone willing to do their homework and tweak some skills could probably more than do it justice)</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Truly "high" fantasy. It's just not built for it. "Medium" and "pulp" swords-and-sorcery however are amply and fantastically supported.</li> </ul><p></p><p>I honestly can't comment on horror. I have never once in my life ever wanted or cared to play RPGs in a horror setting. I'm just not equipped to comment. </p><p></p><p>As far as Star Trek . . . man, that's a tough one. If you're really, really wanting to emulate the tropes of the TV series pretty much dead on, I don't know that Savage would be particularly good at it. If you're willing to take some liberties with it, and really build on the "extended challenge" mechanic presented in the Deluxe rules, you could probably have a good-to-very-good time with it.</p><p></p><p>Recommended Books:</p><p></p><p></p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Savage Worlds Deluxe core rulebook, of course. <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite1" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":)" /> Hardcover or soft, take your pick.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">I really, really dig <em>Interface Zero</em> as a campaign setting. If you really want to give Savage Worlds a shot, and see what it's really capable of before trying to shoehorn it to a "classic" fantasy campaign, this is a fantastic place to start. Based on what I've seen over at Pinnacle's Web site and elsewhere, the people who seem to struggle the most with coming to grips with Savage Worlds are groups that try and switch from D&D directly to Savage Worlds fantasy.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">That said, Hellfrost and Sundered Skies are FANTASTIC settings, if you're dying to make the plunge. Shaintar isn't bad either, though once you get into Savage a little bit, you'll find yourself going crazy with all the homebrew worldbuilding you can do on your own.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">If you have any desire at all to try your hand at a fantasy campaign, pick up the Fantasy Companion, for the magic items alone.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Beyond that, just pick and choose what looks interesting---Deadlands, Weird Wars, Space: 1889, Rippers, Soloman Kane, whatever.</li> </ul></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="innerdude, post: 6212597, member: 85870"] Strengths: [LIST] [*]Once you're over the initial learning curve for the system, a GM with nearly any level of system mastery can prep an entire session in 10 minutes. This is not an exaggeration. It's that easy to set up encounters. [*]As a result, as a GM you can spend nearly all your time setting up plots, and hooks, and stories, and scenarios, and locations, and maps, and just generally doing the "fun stuff" of being GM. [*]Combats are active, engaging, and require good teamwork. There's lots of "setting up your buddy" to make a wicked-good hit using tactics. Plus, characters with any fighting ability are automatically assumed to be able to do most maneuvers. There's no "feat tax" to be able to grapple, or trip. Typically it's just an opposed roll of some kind. [*]Tricks and Tests of Will make it possible for someone who's not specialized in combat to contribute to combats, and have a distinct effect on the outcome. [*]While the wound system isn't perfect IMHO, it's still overall a step up for me from D&D-style hitpoints. Why? [I]Because combat is always taken at least somewhat seriously. [/I]There's no heavily armored fighters running around in battle with archers and crossbowman everywhere saying, "Oh, I'll just eat that 1d8 damage attack. BWAHAHAH!" In the wrong circumstances, a single PC facing two or three low-level crossbowmen will think twice before doing anything stupid. While the exploding dice mechanic nearly always plays into the PC's favor, it still only takes one lucky hit from a mook with a sword, and your character can be in a world of hurt. [*]Speaking of exploding dice, they're just flat out awesome. Yeah, it sometimes makes stuff really "swingy" and a little random. To me this is clearly a feature and not a bug. It makes the tighter damage modeling of 3e, and especially 4e, feel a bit too predictable, even a little uninspired. [*]Literally every single character I've ever seen played in my games, from fantasy to modern spy / military, has been useful. There simply are no dead-weight characters. Every character contributes, every character gets to play fun situational tactics. [*]This is more of a personal preference, but Savage Worlds plays right into the types of combats I like to run---lots of "human" foes of varying skills and tactical awareness. I rarely liked D&D's typical "CR 20 Giant Slavering Muncha-muncha of Demonoid heritage." I like my campaigns to be "human"-centric. Campaigns are interesting because of character and NPC motivations, not because the characters got to go plane hopping and "pown" a Tanar'ri. [*]That said, with the right system knowledge, and a little bit of tweaking, it's easy to set up "boss monster" foes that are fun and challenging. [*]In the same vein, combats can support virtually any terrain or interesting "spacing" you can imagine. Fire pits? Narrow rope bridges? Crumbling stone walls? Bring it on! And don't forget to let your players know what's actually in the room---pots, glasses, broken bottles, a chair leg, a roll of cloth or burlap. A creative player can use all of these to devastating effect with fighting "tricks." [*]As easy as the core system is to "grok," it's pretty difficult for players to go on total "autopilot." It's hard to explain, other than in my experience, players are consistently asked to engage with what's happening in the game world. The fact that every combat can pose a real threat, and every GM hook can be pursued without fear of going someplace "unprepared," means as a GM you can totally mold the narrative to what the characters want. It's almost impossible to NOT make the characters the heroes of the story, because it's so easy to give them what they want, when they want it. [/LIST] Weaknesses: [LIST] [*]The wound mechanic isn't for everyone. It's a mechanic that makes no bones about the fact that in a lot of ways, it's a purely metagame concept. Some players find it disheartening when they think, "Yeah, I totally destroyed that guy!" only to have the foe get a raise on their soak roll and negate the damage. My players are very good with this though, in that they understand what the system is emulating (a simplified hitpoint system)---but it also makes those hits that do finally score real damage that much more satisfying. [*]There are no "throw away" combats. Every combat has the potential, with some good/bad luck on the GM's dice, to cripple the party. If you're looking for a game where players can just have a "casual" combat every session, just to get their kicks out of some combat tactics, it's tough to do that without making the combat a total pushover. [*]The hardest part as a fledgling GM is figuring out how to balance encounters. There's really no guidelines, and it really does take 2-5 combats as a GM before you really start to get a feel for what your characters are capable of. Once you sort of understand the basics (3 mooks = 1 "Wild Card" character), it gets a little easier. Furthermore, there's lots of help on the forums with encounter setup. [*]I don't personally find this a weakness, but some do---the power curve for Savage Worlds PCs is very tight. It's the equivalent of D&D PCs progressing from levels 2-9, or maybe 3-10. Players looking for the "epic," super-gonzo feel of high-level D&D are going to be disappointed. Personally, I love this, but be aware it is what it is. [*]There's absolutely nothing wrong with Savage's out-of-the-box magic rules, they're just far from the highlight of the system. They're merely good, or adequate, though if you're sick of high-powered D&D magic-user nonsense, this might be a welcome change. Otherwise, if you have players that REALLY want to be the "Mage of mages," Savage probably isn't a great fit. [/LIST] Genres: I personally have run a "classic" fantasy campaign (FANTASTIC!), a paramilitary / covert ops modern day campaign (pretty good, could have been better because I know the system better now), and a Serenity / Firefly campaign (great system for this world). Savage Worlds handled all of these genres with aplomb. I'm itching to try a Star Wars campaign with it, a cyberpunk campaign using the Interface Zero campaign setting, a "Pirates of the Caribbean" campaign using 50 Fathoms and / or Pirates of the Spanish Main, and Weird Wars Rome. Genres I think Savage Worlds would handle extremely well: [LIST] [*]Classic fantasy [*]James Bond-style spy thriller [*]Urban fantasy, in a multitude of time periods (modern, Victorian, etc.) [*]"Kinetic" cyberpunk (think the old '90s movie [I]Strange Days [/I]and not [I]Blade Runner[/I]) [*]"Pulp" Sci-fi [*]Really pretty much any sci-fi that avoids more "hard tech" tropes [*]Any Age of Sails / Victorian era settings [*]With the right sanity mechanic (see [I]Realms of Cthulu[/I]), a Cthulu-style game. [*]Pulp to semi-gritty "film noir." I haven't purchased it yet, but everything I've ever seen about Deadlands: Noir makes it seem like a truly fantastic setting. [*]Western [/LIST] Genres for which I think Savage Worlds would not be the best choice: [LIST] [*]"Hard" sci-fi [*]High-powered superheroes. It MIGHT be okay doing a somewhat low-powered, X-Men-ish style, but certainly not Green Lantern / Superman. If you hunt the Web, this is a fairly common comment about the system in general. [*]Hard-core mystery / investigation campaigns (though someone willing to do their homework and tweak some skills could probably more than do it justice) [*]Truly "high" fantasy. It's just not built for it. "Medium" and "pulp" swords-and-sorcery however are amply and fantastically supported. [/LIST] I honestly can't comment on horror. I have never once in my life ever wanted or cared to play RPGs in a horror setting. I'm just not equipped to comment. As far as Star Trek . . . man, that's a tough one. If you're really, really wanting to emulate the tropes of the TV series pretty much dead on, I don't know that Savage would be particularly good at it. If you're willing to take some liberties with it, and really build on the "extended challenge" mechanic presented in the Deluxe rules, you could probably have a good-to-very-good time with it. Recommended Books: [LIST] [*]Savage Worlds Deluxe core rulebook, of course. :) Hardcover or soft, take your pick. [*]I really, really dig [I]Interface Zero[/I] as a campaign setting. If you really want to give Savage Worlds a shot, and see what it's really capable of before trying to shoehorn it to a "classic" fantasy campaign, this is a fantastic place to start. Based on what I've seen over at Pinnacle's Web site and elsewhere, the people who seem to struggle the most with coming to grips with Savage Worlds are groups that try and switch from D&D directly to Savage Worlds fantasy. [*]That said, Hellfrost and Sundered Skies are FANTASTIC settings, if you're dying to make the plunge. Shaintar isn't bad either, though once you get into Savage a little bit, you'll find yourself going crazy with all the homebrew worldbuilding you can do on your own. [*]If you have any desire at all to try your hand at a fantasy campaign, pick up the Fantasy Companion, for the magic items alone. [*]Beyond that, just pick and choose what looks interesting---Deadlands, Weird Wars, Space: 1889, Rippers, Soloman Kane, whatever. [/LIST] [/QUOTE]
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