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General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
the Awakened Animal thread
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<blockquote data-quote="Conaill" data-source="post: 1459772" data-attributes="member: 1264"><p><strong>References and reasoning</strong></p><p></p><p>The Awaken spell:</p><p>The Augmented subtype:</p><p>From Improving Monsters - Templates:</p><p>How extra HD work for Animal Companions:</p><p>The FAQ on size increases for Animal Companions:</p><p></p><p></p><p>Conclusions:</p><p></p><p>1) By default, the change in type to magical beast should *not* result in a change in HD size, BAB, saves and skills, because those are *features* of it's original type.</p><p></p><p>2) The awakened animal should receive the *traits* of the magical beast type (mainly darkvision).</p><p></p><p>3) For consistency and simplicity (especially CR and LA calculation), the awakened animal should receive all the usual benefits for an increase in HD, including BAB, saves, skills and feats.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Judgement calls:</p><p></p><p>1) Similar to animal companions, I decided *not* to grant a size increase with increase in HD (when the animal advancement would call for it). I just don't think the animal should suddenly look drastically different after awakening it. Plus size increases have to be included separately when calculating CR and LA, so leaving this out simplifies things.</p><p></p><p>2) Minor: traits of the Animal type include attack and damage penalties for "noncombative herbivores", and armor proficiency for animals trained for war. The magical beast type doesn't contain those special clauses, so an awakened goat would lose it's attack and damage penalties, and the awakened warhorse would lose its proficiency with barding. I decided to let the trained war animal keep it's armor proficiency, because it doesn't make much sense that it would just "forget" how to use it.</p><p></p><p></p><p>WotC published Awakened animals:</p><p>- <a href="http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/eo/20031003a" target="_blank">Splitfang: The Dire Wolf Barbarian</a></p><p>- <a href="http://www.wizards.com/dnd/files/Santa.pdf" target="_blank">Santa's Reindeers</a></p><p></p><p>Both of these use all-d8 HD and animal BAB. Interestingly, neither has Darkvision. Maybe that's a 3.5 change? Splitfang's CR seems too high as well: Dire Wolf CR 3 + Awakened CR 1 + Brb1 = CR 5? (listed as CR 6 - I don't think Awakening is worth +2 CR)</p><p></p><p></p><p>I managed to find a published counter-example as well. Dragon #313, p86 contains the "Elder Serpent" template, which is essentially an enhanced version of "Awaken Snake". I don't have the original article (could anyone please doublecheck this?), but the <a href="http://www.crystalkeep.com/d20/rules/DnD3.5Index-Templates.pdf" target="_blank">Crystalkeep index of templates</a> lists it as switching to d10 HD and Fighter BAB. It has some pretty huge stat increases (+2 to all physical stats, +2d6+6 Int, +2d4+4 Wis and Cha), the usual +2HD, and a number of other SA and SQ. All for a measly +2 CR and +3 LA (which is useless if the underlying snake doesn't have an LA listed anyway).</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Conaill, post: 1459772, member: 1264"] [b]References and reasoning[/b] The Awaken spell: The Augmented subtype: From Improving Monsters - Templates: How extra HD work for Animal Companions: The FAQ on size increases for Animal Companions: Conclusions: 1) By default, the change in type to magical beast should *not* result in a change in HD size, BAB, saves and skills, because those are *features* of it's original type. 2) The awakened animal should receive the *traits* of the magical beast type (mainly darkvision). 3) For consistency and simplicity (especially CR and LA calculation), the awakened animal should receive all the usual benefits for an increase in HD, including BAB, saves, skills and feats. Judgement calls: 1) Similar to animal companions, I decided *not* to grant a size increase with increase in HD (when the animal advancement would call for it). I just don't think the animal should suddenly look drastically different after awakening it. Plus size increases have to be included separately when calculating CR and LA, so leaving this out simplifies things. 2) Minor: traits of the Animal type include attack and damage penalties for "noncombative herbivores", and armor proficiency for animals trained for war. The magical beast type doesn't contain those special clauses, so an awakened goat would lose it's attack and damage penalties, and the awakened warhorse would lose its proficiency with barding. I decided to let the trained war animal keep it's armor proficiency, because it doesn't make much sense that it would just "forget" how to use it. WotC published Awakened animals: - [url=http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/eo/20031003a]Splitfang: The Dire Wolf Barbarian[/url] - [url=http://www.wizards.com/dnd/files/Santa.pdf]Santa's Reindeers[/url] Both of these use all-d8 HD and animal BAB. Interestingly, neither has Darkvision. Maybe that's a 3.5 change? Splitfang's CR seems too high as well: Dire Wolf CR 3 + Awakened CR 1 + Brb1 = CR 5? (listed as CR 6 - I don't think Awakening is worth +2 CR) I managed to find a published counter-example as well. Dragon #313, p86 contains the "Elder Serpent" template, which is essentially an enhanced version of "Awaken Snake". I don't have the original article (could anyone please doublecheck this?), but the [url=http://www.crystalkeep.com/d20/rules/DnD3.5Index-Templates.pdf]Crystalkeep index of templates[/url] lists it as switching to d10 HD and Fighter BAB. It has some pretty huge stat increases (+2 to all physical stats, +2d6+6 Int, +2d4+4 Wis and Cha), the usual +2HD, and a number of other SA and SQ. All for a measly +2 CR and +3 LA (which is useless if the underlying snake doesn't have an LA listed anyway). [/QUOTE]
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