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<blockquote data-quote="Manbearcat" data-source="post: 6562848" data-attributes="member: 6696971"><p>Yup.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I agree that 5e is very vulnerable to illusionism GMing. It hits all the marks that I noted above. Further, from a cultural perspective, it definitely seems to harken back to that 90's era of WW/AD&D2e play that was the epicenter for illusionism; "roleplaying not rollplaying", utterly metagame averse, its the GMs game and they have absolute authority.</p><p></p><p>And I don't have a problem with that. I mean, while I absolutely abhor the practice (while basically have a PHD in it), it is all well and good that plenty of folks do it. Just admit what is going on. But therein lies the rub, the house of cards illusionism is built upon comes tumbling down the moment that you're honest with your players (that is unless they're welling co-consiprators; participationists). And I have to say, most, but not all, of the illusionist-heavy GMs that I watched run games had toxic, paranoid, passive-aggressive relationships with their players simmering just below the surface. The table dynamic just oozed it.</p><p></p><p>All that being said, while 5e has a lot of embedded vulnerability to illusionism, it is infinitely more robust, clear, and coherent than AD&D. I think after 6 months of running games or so, I could easily pick out the most vulnerable areas and hem them in to make it mostly illusionism-proof.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Manbearcat, post: 6562848, member: 6696971"] Yup. I agree that 5e is very vulnerable to illusionism GMing. It hits all the marks that I noted above. Further, from a cultural perspective, it definitely seems to harken back to that 90's era of WW/AD&D2e play that was the epicenter for illusionism; "roleplaying not rollplaying", utterly metagame averse, its the GMs game and they have absolute authority. And I don't have a problem with that. I mean, while I absolutely abhor the practice (while basically have a PHD in it), it is all well and good that plenty of folks do it. Just admit what is going on. But therein lies the rub, the house of cards illusionism is built upon comes tumbling down the moment that you're honest with your players (that is unless they're welling co-consiprators; participationists). And I have to say, most, but not all, of the illusionist-heavy GMs that I watched run games had toxic, paranoid, passive-aggressive relationships with their players simmering just below the surface. The table dynamic just oozed it. All that being said, while 5e has a lot of embedded vulnerability to illusionism, it is infinitely more robust, clear, and coherent than AD&D. I think after 6 months of running games or so, I could easily pick out the most vulnerable areas and hem them in to make it mostly illusionism-proof. [/QUOTE]
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