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General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
The double standard for magical and mundane abilities
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<blockquote data-quote="Manbearcat" data-source="post: 6362216" data-attributes="member: 6696971"><p>Just a quick note about my post upthread regarding (a) the lack of process-simulation of spellcasters in their actual spellcraft in D&D and (b) folks indifference about it who are simultaneously intent on granular process-simulation of fightercraft and roguecraft (because versimulitude).</p><p></p><p>I've GMed quite a bit of Dungeon World. Most of that GMing has had a Fighter character alongside a Wizard character. In Dungeon World, the basic resolution scheme for actions (moves) is:</p><p></p><p>Roll 2d6 + (bounded) modifier.</p><p></p><p>* on a 10 + you do what you set out to do</p><p>* on a 7-9 you have success with complications</p><p>* on a 6- you mark XP and something not-so-good happens</p><p></p><p>The math of the system puts intentionally puts most outcomes in 7-9 as it generates the most compelling and dynamic play. Every time a Wizard casts a spell...guess what?</p><p></p><p>[h=3]<span style="font-size: 15px">Cast a Spell (Int)</span>[/h] When you <strong>release a spell you’ve prepared</strong>, roll+Int.</p><p> <strong>✴</strong> On a 10+, the spell is successfully cast and you do not forget the spell—you may cast it again later.</p><p> <strong>✴</strong> On a 7-9, the spell is cast, but choose one:</p><p> </p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">You draw unwelcome attention or put yourself in a spot. The GM will tell you how. </li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">The spell disturbs the fabric of reality as it is cast—take -1 ongoing to cast a spell until the next time you Prepare Spells. </li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">After it is cast, the spell is forgotten. You cannot cast the spell again until you prepare spells. </li> </ul><p></p><p>In Dungeon World:</p><p></p><p>1) The Fighter is extremely powerful and has some extremely awesome fiat/trump card abilities (such as the ability to intuit outcomes, who lives or dies, on the battlefield before its been settled...or divine information from the psychic resonance or spirits of those who have held/died by his signature weapon).</p><p></p><p>2) The Fighter has + 2 armor base, d10 + Con HP and d10 damage. The Wizard has 0 armor base, and d4 in both HP and damage.</p><p></p><p>3) The Wizard gets less (significantly so when considering some editions) spells than any Wizard in D&D, sans 4e.</p><p></p><p>4) The Wizard's spells are less powerful than in in D&D.</p><p></p><p>5) The Wizard must interface with the basic action resolution mechanics every time they cast a spell (test their spellcraft).</p><p></p><p>All of these things persist in DW. Regardless of that, Wizards are every part as powerful as Fighters. What does that say about D&D and the mainstream (?) acceptance of, and sometimes absurd lengths gone in defense of, its paradigm? </p><p></p><p>It says the thread topic is on the money.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Manbearcat, post: 6362216, member: 6696971"] Just a quick note about my post upthread regarding (a) the lack of process-simulation of spellcasters in their actual spellcraft in D&D and (b) folks indifference about it who are simultaneously intent on granular process-simulation of fightercraft and roguecraft (because versimulitude). I've GMed quite a bit of Dungeon World. Most of that GMing has had a Fighter character alongside a Wizard character. In Dungeon World, the basic resolution scheme for actions (moves) is: Roll 2d6 + (bounded) modifier. * on a 10 + you do what you set out to do * on a 7-9 you have success with complications * on a 6- you mark XP and something not-so-good happens The math of the system puts intentionally puts most outcomes in 7-9 as it generates the most compelling and dynamic play. Every time a Wizard casts a spell...guess what? [h=3][SIZE=4]Cast a Spell (Int)[/SIZE][/h] When you [B]release a spell you’ve prepared[/B], roll+Int. [B]✴[/B] On a 10+, the spell is successfully cast and you do not forget the spell—you may cast it again later. [B]✴[/B] On a 7-9, the spell is cast, but choose one: [LIST] [*]You draw unwelcome attention or put yourself in a spot. The GM will tell you how. [*]The spell disturbs the fabric of reality as it is cast—take -1 ongoing to cast a spell until the next time you Prepare Spells. [*]After it is cast, the spell is forgotten. You cannot cast the spell again until you prepare spells. [/LIST] In Dungeon World: 1) The Fighter is extremely powerful and has some extremely awesome fiat/trump card abilities (such as the ability to intuit outcomes, who lives or dies, on the battlefield before its been settled...or divine information from the psychic resonance or spirits of those who have held/died by his signature weapon). 2) The Fighter has + 2 armor base, d10 + Con HP and d10 damage. The Wizard has 0 armor base, and d4 in both HP and damage. 3) The Wizard gets less (significantly so when considering some editions) spells than any Wizard in D&D, sans 4e. 4) The Wizard's spells are less powerful than in in D&D. 5) The Wizard must interface with the basic action resolution mechanics every time they cast a spell (test their spellcraft). All of these things persist in DW. Regardless of that, Wizards are every part as powerful as Fighters. What does that say about D&D and the mainstream (?) acceptance of, and sometimes absurd lengths gone in defense of, its paradigm? It says the thread topic is on the money. [/QUOTE]
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