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The final word on DPR, feats and class balance
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<blockquote data-quote="Tony Vargas" data-source="post: 7437982" data-attributes="member: 996"><p>Yeah, should be 300 yds, to fit the myth of the English longbow. <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite2" alt=";)" title="Wink ;)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=";)" /></p><p>And SS makes you just as accurate at long range as point blank. Which is lovely for the Robin Hood types, but there's no similar level of reality-pushing for most other weapon choices.</p><p></p><p> "In the back" is probably unfair, on my part.</p><p></p><p> A thrown weapon hits harder than one held, because humans naturally pull back slightly when hitting something (it's instinctive, to avoid hurting yourself, martial artists try to train it away), a thrown knife can /easily/ penetrate human flesh to the hilt. D&D daggers are like a foot long, all the vital organs in the human body are very much on it's menu. Absolutely a lethal weapon.</p><p></p><p> I was thinking more Rogue vs SS.</p><p></p><p> Heh. Fantasy has a lower standard than /that/. So groan at the movie (if you're not in a theatre), but hold 'em in at the gaming table, please! <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite2" alt=";)" title="Wink ;)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=";)" /></p><p></p><p> I want to say you shouldn't be playing FRPGs, at all, you should be playing Aftermath, or something with that level of realism - but, really, it's all so subjective, what seems like too much or too little - too RL-realistic for fantasy or too gonzo for gritty fantasy or whatever - is something groups need to work out for themselves. </p><p></p><p>Systems should, ideally, be more concerned with mechanics that are workable/playable/balanced, and leave the descriptions and interpretations of the fiction as suggestions that can float. 5e does give the DM that latitude, so, as DM, you'd be w/in your rights to change what a given feat (or not opt into feats in the first place, still my preferred solution) or other game element represents in the fiction (along with any mechanical tweaks that may imply). There might be some back-and-forth with a player trying to build to a given concept, but it seems like the kind of things DMs should be up for...</p><p></p><p> And hps have long done a surprisingly good job of modeling plot armor - even if it's never been clear that's what they're doing. ;|</p><p></p><p> Much as I agree, those options were discarded as insufficient (throwing out feats would render fighters non-viable, throwing out MCing wouldn't allow the players the characters they wanted, etc - to the OP's standard, anyway) right in the first post. </p><p></p><p> It is, that. And, much as weapons all doing the same damage would be an amusing reference the games' earliest days for those few who remember the pre-fad years, it wouldn't turn the "feels like D&D" litmus paper the right color for anyone else.</p><p></p><p>There's rather a lot of character-based damage, really - bonuses, SA dice, scaling cantrip damage, etc - but only as a component on top of other 'fiddly bit' damage sources & modifiers.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Tony Vargas, post: 7437982, member: 996"] Yeah, should be 300 yds, to fit the myth of the English longbow. ;) And SS makes you just as accurate at long range as point blank. Which is lovely for the Robin Hood types, but there's no similar level of reality-pushing for most other weapon choices. "In the back" is probably unfair, on my part. A thrown weapon hits harder than one held, because humans naturally pull back slightly when hitting something (it's instinctive, to avoid hurting yourself, martial artists try to train it away), a thrown knife can /easily/ penetrate human flesh to the hilt. D&D daggers are like a foot long, all the vital organs in the human body are very much on it's menu. Absolutely a lethal weapon. I was thinking more Rogue vs SS. Heh. Fantasy has a lower standard than /that/. So groan at the movie (if you're not in a theatre), but hold 'em in at the gaming table, please! ;) I want to say you shouldn't be playing FRPGs, at all, you should be playing Aftermath, or something with that level of realism - but, really, it's all so subjective, what seems like too much or too little - too RL-realistic for fantasy or too gonzo for gritty fantasy or whatever - is something groups need to work out for themselves. Systems should, ideally, be more concerned with mechanics that are workable/playable/balanced, and leave the descriptions and interpretations of the fiction as suggestions that can float. 5e does give the DM that latitude, so, as DM, you'd be w/in your rights to change what a given feat (or not opt into feats in the first place, still my preferred solution) or other game element represents in the fiction (along with any mechanical tweaks that may imply). There might be some back-and-forth with a player trying to build to a given concept, but it seems like the kind of things DMs should be up for... And hps have long done a surprisingly good job of modeling plot armor - even if it's never been clear that's what they're doing. ;| Much as I agree, those options were discarded as insufficient (throwing out feats would render fighters non-viable, throwing out MCing wouldn't allow the players the characters they wanted, etc - to the OP's standard, anyway) right in the first post. It is, that. And, much as weapons all doing the same damage would be an amusing reference the games' earliest days for those few who remember the pre-fad years, it wouldn't turn the "feels like D&D" litmus paper the right color for anyone else. There's rather a lot of character-based damage, really - bonuses, SA dice, scaling cantrip damage, etc - but only as a component on top of other 'fiddly bit' damage sources & modifiers. [/QUOTE]
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