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<blockquote data-quote="CreamCloud0" data-source="post: 9337352" data-attributes="member: 7034710"><p>this is why earlier i said that i think the martials need to be bumped up to the rogue's current skill capacity, spreading expertise more generously to the martials lets them break past the swingyness of the d20, BA is a good idea in theory but without expertise there's no significant mitigation of the influence of that lone d20 roll for most classes,</p><p></p><p></p><p>i say martials should get reliable talent on either all their trained skills or class skills, unsure which i'd go with in the long run, and minimum 2 expertise at 1st level, this makes them consistent, reliable and capable.</p><p></p><p>you know that your level 5 fighter (16 STR), cannot roll lower than a 19 on an athletics check (RT10+PB3+EX3+STR3) but by that same measure they're not going to roll higher than a 29, a range of 10,</p><p></p><p>this is in comparison to a wizard of the same level making an arcana check who's minimum potential check is 7 (NAT1+PB3+INT3) versus 26 max for a range of 19(20? the numbers say 19 but logic says a d20 should have a range of 20 right?),</p><p></p><p>so 30% of the time a Lvl5 caster is going to be able to reach the lower rungs of what a Lvl5 martial achieves 89% (i think?) of the time in their best skills. (provided my mental maths is correct, even if i'm wrong i think it should be in the right ballpark), and even if they do get expertise a caster isn't going to have the stabilising factor of reliable talent.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="CreamCloud0, post: 9337352, member: 7034710"] this is why earlier i said that i think the martials need to be bumped up to the rogue's current skill capacity, spreading expertise more generously to the martials lets them break past the swingyness of the d20, BA is a good idea in theory but without expertise there's no significant mitigation of the influence of that lone d20 roll for most classes, i say martials should get reliable talent on either all their trained skills or class skills, unsure which i'd go with in the long run, and minimum 2 expertise at 1st level, this makes them consistent, reliable and capable. you know that your level 5 fighter (16 STR), cannot roll lower than a 19 on an athletics check (RT10+PB3+EX3+STR3) but by that same measure they're not going to roll higher than a 29, a range of 10, this is in comparison to a wizard of the same level making an arcana check who's minimum potential check is 7 (NAT1+PB3+INT3) versus 26 max for a range of 19(20? the numbers say 19 but logic says a d20 should have a range of 20 right?), so 30% of the time a Lvl5 caster is going to be able to reach the lower rungs of what a Lvl5 martial achieves 89% (i think?) of the time in their best skills. (provided my mental maths is correct, even if i'm wrong i think it should be in the right ballpark), and even if they do get expertise a caster isn't going to have the stabilising factor of reliable talent. [/QUOTE]
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