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Community
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*Dungeons & Dragons
The Mechanical Impact of -5/+10
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<blockquote data-quote="CapnZapp" data-source="post: 7548617" data-attributes="member: 12731"><p>Like with every GWM analysis before, I miss the real actual play advice that matters.</p><p></p><p>Never use GWM without Advantage, unless enemy AC is atrocious. Of course, good players make sure to gain advantage all the time, so this is not exactly a change of tactics. One easy tip: attack unseen.</p><p></p><p>One way to comprehensively break the feat is to be a Battlemaster Fighter using the Precision maneuver. The secret is that Precision is much more economical than most maneuvers. Most maneuvers need you to spend a die each time you stand to gain the benefit. Precision's benefit is avoiding a miss, and you only need to spend a die when you miss and want to turn it into a hit. What this means in practice is that your dice lasts much longer.</p><p></p><p>Add just a little spice (Bless, a magical weapon with a bonus, what have you) and you will find that your new feat can double your damage output, and often will.</p><p></p><p>It's when you see with your own eyes your player hit with three attacks at level eight or so* for something like 55 damage round after round at distances up to 120 feet, that you realize the developers never really played the game the way your players do, and that you need to do WotCs job for them and remove that feat (Crossbow Expert).</p><p></p><p>In light of this, I'm not sure what the point of analyzing the feat in isolation is. No driven player ever uses the feat in situations where you actually need to pay the unmitigated -5 to gain the +10.</p><p></p><p>*) Referencing my player's Ranger/Fighter build that gets to three attacks ahead of the fighter. Sorry, it was a while ago so I'm a bit hazy on the details. Damage is 1d6+5+10 times three for ~55 damage.</p><p></p><p>Which is nice and all, but the real sadness?</p><p></p><p>Without the feat, that damage would have been 30 lower, which is less than half. (The slightly increased miss chance means that's pessimistic in real play. And other classes can match the damage). </p><p></p><p>Still, the -5/+10 completely invalidate a lot of character concepts simply by virtue of existing. Put in simple terms: if you're a fighter in a feat-enabled game, you can forget about competitive DPR if you have other feats or concepts in mind than what can be used with GWM or CE. </p><p></p><p>And <strong>that's</strong> what's broken here.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="CapnZapp, post: 7548617, member: 12731"] Like with every GWM analysis before, I miss the real actual play advice that matters. Never use GWM without Advantage, unless enemy AC is atrocious. Of course, good players make sure to gain advantage all the time, so this is not exactly a change of tactics. One easy tip: attack unseen. One way to comprehensively break the feat is to be a Battlemaster Fighter using the Precision maneuver. The secret is that Precision is much more economical than most maneuvers. Most maneuvers need you to spend a die each time you stand to gain the benefit. Precision's benefit is avoiding a miss, and you only need to spend a die when you miss and want to turn it into a hit. What this means in practice is that your dice lasts much longer. Add just a little spice (Bless, a magical weapon with a bonus, what have you) and you will find that your new feat can double your damage output, and often will. It's when you see with your own eyes your player hit with three attacks at level eight or so* for something like 55 damage round after round at distances up to 120 feet, that you realize the developers never really played the game the way your players do, and that you need to do WotCs job for them and remove that feat (Crossbow Expert). In light of this, I'm not sure what the point of analyzing the feat in isolation is. No driven player ever uses the feat in situations where you actually need to pay the unmitigated -5 to gain the +10. *) Referencing my player's Ranger/Fighter build that gets to three attacks ahead of the fighter. Sorry, it was a while ago so I'm a bit hazy on the details. Damage is 1d6+5+10 times three for ~55 damage. Which is nice and all, but the real sadness? Without the feat, that damage would have been 30 lower, which is less than half. (The slightly increased miss chance means that's pessimistic in real play. And other classes can match the damage). Still, the -5/+10 completely invalidate a lot of character concepts simply by virtue of existing. Put in simple terms: if you're a fighter in a feat-enabled game, you can forget about competitive DPR if you have other feats or concepts in mind than what can be used with GWM or CE. And [B]that's[/B] what's broken here. [/QUOTE]
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