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General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
The mix of magical, pseudo magical, and non-magical classes
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<blockquote data-quote="Eldritch_Lord" data-source="post: 5836036" data-attributes="member: 52073"><p>Ideally, for me, you'd have the four archetypal classes to start with, which I define as the "nonmagical combat guy" (fighter), the "nonmagical utility guy" (rogue), the "magical combat guy" (cleric), and the "magical utility guy" (wizard). Yes, the cleric and wizard both do both combat and utility, and the blaster wizard is iconic, but that stems primarily from casters being able to do everything, and the <em>most</em> iconic parts of each class fit those distinctions (what separates D&D clerics from "generic fantasy priests" are in-combat healing, turning undead, smiting evil things, etc. first and <em>heroes' feast</em> and the like second; what separates D&D wizards from "generic fantasy mages" are scrying, divinations, <em>rope trick</em>, <em>invisibility</em>, etc. first and <em>fireball</em> a very very close second).</p><p></p><p>Given those four, you then take the 6 pairwise permutations for your other classes:</p><p>Arcane + Skill = Bard (obviously)</p><p>Arcane + Combat = Ranger (the 1e ranger could use both arcane and divine magic, and making the ranger a gish-y class would work nicely to diversify him past "the nature guy who hates certain creatures")</p><p>Arcane + Divine = Druid (druids have plenty of overlap of the arcane and divine niches, with the healing/warding/weather stuff of clerics and the summoning/shapechanging/blasting of wizards)</p><p>Skill + Combat = Barbarian (give the 5e barbarian more of a nature/totemic focus than he has now so he isn't just "the angry fighter")</p><p>Skill + Divine = Monk (making the monk more explicitly divine would help with its lack of focus)</p><p>Combat + Divine = Paladin (obviously)</p><p></p><p>That mix gives you 3 purely magical classes, 3 purely nonmagical classes, and 4 mixed magical/nonmagical classes. Hopefully there would be enough options for each combination class that they could focus more on one "side" or the other, so if you wanted a party with no overlapping classes you could have a party of a wizard, a cleric, a druid, and a bard/ranger/monk/paladin focusing on the more magical abilities for an "all magic" party or a party of a fighter, a rogue, a barbarian, and a bard/ranger/monk/paladin focusing on the less magical abilities for a "no magic" party, and of course if the four mixes go for an even split you could have a party of a bard, a ranger, a monk, and a paladin that's nicely balanced all around without running into the 5th-wheel problem that AD&D/3e bards and monks run into sometimes.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Eldritch_Lord, post: 5836036, member: 52073"] Ideally, for me, you'd have the four archetypal classes to start with, which I define as the "nonmagical combat guy" (fighter), the "nonmagical utility guy" (rogue), the "magical combat guy" (cleric), and the "magical utility guy" (wizard). Yes, the cleric and wizard both do both combat and utility, and the blaster wizard is iconic, but that stems primarily from casters being able to do everything, and the [I]most[/I] iconic parts of each class fit those distinctions (what separates D&D clerics from "generic fantasy priests" are in-combat healing, turning undead, smiting evil things, etc. first and [I]heroes' feast[/i] and the like second; what separates D&D wizards from "generic fantasy mages" are scrying, divinations, [I]rope trick[/I], [I]invisibility[/I], etc. first and [I]fireball[/I] a very very close second). Given those four, you then take the 6 pairwise permutations for your other classes: Arcane + Skill = Bard (obviously) Arcane + Combat = Ranger (the 1e ranger could use both arcane and divine magic, and making the ranger a gish-y class would work nicely to diversify him past "the nature guy who hates certain creatures") Arcane + Divine = Druid (druids have plenty of overlap of the arcane and divine niches, with the healing/warding/weather stuff of clerics and the summoning/shapechanging/blasting of wizards) Skill + Combat = Barbarian (give the 5e barbarian more of a nature/totemic focus than he has now so he isn't just "the angry fighter") Skill + Divine = Monk (making the monk more explicitly divine would help with its lack of focus) Combat + Divine = Paladin (obviously) That mix gives you 3 purely magical classes, 3 purely nonmagical classes, and 4 mixed magical/nonmagical classes. Hopefully there would be enough options for each combination class that they could focus more on one "side" or the other, so if you wanted a party with no overlapping classes you could have a party of a wizard, a cleric, a druid, and a bard/ranger/monk/paladin focusing on the more magical abilities for an "all magic" party or a party of a fighter, a rogue, a barbarian, and a bard/ranger/monk/paladin focusing on the less magical abilities for a "no magic" party, and of course if the four mixes go for an even split you could have a party of a bard, a ranger, a monk, and a paladin that's nicely balanced all around without running into the 5th-wheel problem that AD&D/3e bards and monks run into sometimes. [/QUOTE]
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