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*Pathfinder & Starfinder
The Nd20 system (Epic-level play rejigged)
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<blockquote data-quote="poilbrun" data-source="post: 432280" data-attributes="member: 532"><p><strong>Re: Re: Re: With all due respect...</strong></p><p></p><p></p><p>The first time I played the White Wolf line of RPGs, Iwas a werewolf who, when transformed, fought so good that I had to throw 14 dices at the same time... I actually enjoyed it! <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite8" alt=":D" title="Big grin :D" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":D" /> </p><p></p><p>For the subject at hand, I see problem arising. Let's look at it if you make the jump from 1 to 2 D20 at level 21, from 2 to 3 at level 41, etc. A level 40 fighter-type (either ftr 20/brb 20, or with PrC) will have 2d20+40+other bonuses (STR, magic, weapon focus and the like - let's say +15)=57-95. A level 41 fighter-type has 3d20+41+15=59-116. That means that by going up by one level, you give him the potential to hit a creature with an AC higher by 21 points!! <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite9" alt=":eek:" title="Eek! :eek:" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":eek:" /> </p><p></p><p>The other problem will be caused by luck/unluck. A level 41 fighter type face a level 60 fighter type. The level 41 has a range of 54-111. The level 60 has a range of 3d20+60+20 (he probably has a better weapon, has improved his strength, has taken a more powerful feat...)=83-140. If the level 41 is lucky, rolling 3 20's and the level 60 has no luck rolling 3 1's, we have a level 41 fighter-type fighting A LOT better than the level 60 fighter-type, even though, in theory, there should be no way that a character with 19 less levels than an other should win the fight.</p><p></p><p>Of course, on the long run, things will tend toward the average, but I think that such a system could really ruin good roleplaying. If the PC are really unlucky, they will have troubles with the henchmen of the main villain during the whole adventure. Then, come the final fight against the villain, they are again lucky when you're not, and the fight is a piece of cake for them... They'll wonder why that one was the villain and not his follower (who was 15 levels lower), who was able to kill two party members.</p><p></p><p>These are the flaws I see in this system, but then I'm not disappointed with the epic rules in the ELH... Well, I'm not right now, I'll tell you in about a week or so when I start playing with them! <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite8" alt=":D" title="Big grin :D" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":D" /></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="poilbrun, post: 432280, member: 532"] [b]Re: Re: Re: With all due respect...[/b] The first time I played the White Wolf line of RPGs, Iwas a werewolf who, when transformed, fought so good that I had to throw 14 dices at the same time... I actually enjoyed it! :D For the subject at hand, I see problem arising. Let's look at it if you make the jump from 1 to 2 D20 at level 21, from 2 to 3 at level 41, etc. A level 40 fighter-type (either ftr 20/brb 20, or with PrC) will have 2d20+40+other bonuses (STR, magic, weapon focus and the like - let's say +15)=57-95. A level 41 fighter-type has 3d20+41+15=59-116. That means that by going up by one level, you give him the potential to hit a creature with an AC higher by 21 points!! :eek: The other problem will be caused by luck/unluck. A level 41 fighter type face a level 60 fighter type. The level 41 has a range of 54-111. The level 60 has a range of 3d20+60+20 (he probably has a better weapon, has improved his strength, has taken a more powerful feat...)=83-140. If the level 41 is lucky, rolling 3 20's and the level 60 has no luck rolling 3 1's, we have a level 41 fighter-type fighting A LOT better than the level 60 fighter-type, even though, in theory, there should be no way that a character with 19 less levels than an other should win the fight. Of course, on the long run, things will tend toward the average, but I think that such a system could really ruin good roleplaying. If the PC are really unlucky, they will have troubles with the henchmen of the main villain during the whole adventure. Then, come the final fight against the villain, they are again lucky when you're not, and the fight is a piece of cake for them... They'll wonder why that one was the villain and not his follower (who was 15 levels lower), who was able to kill two party members. These are the flaws I see in this system, but then I'm not disappointed with the epic rules in the ELH... Well, I'm not right now, I'll tell you in about a week or so when I start playing with them! :D [/QUOTE]
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