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<blockquote data-quote="BlackJaw" data-source="post: 986088" data-attributes="member: 888"><p>Back to an old topic.</p><p></p><p>1) I don't really think it something the game needs, rogues & fighters could fit this bill 9 times out of 10.</p><p>2) I don't think most Pilot Classes out there are all that fun or well made. Most are Rogues without rogue abilities or sneak attack, and their class features only work in vehicles. In a standard or quasi-standard game (one where stuff does happen outside a vehicle) the classes are little better then running the NPC class "expert."</p><p>3) Most pilot classes are only geared toward flying a vehicle, with little thought to other meathods of flight that some games might have... flying carpets, fly spells, wildshape/polymorph, and flying mounts.</p><p>4) People will expect a flight product to have a good pilot (or otherwise flight based) core class, so despite my objections above I do think we need to at least try to come up with one.</p><p></p><p></p><p>>> It will need to be functional outside of flying a vehicle and have at least some class features that you can use regularly even if you happen to be underground for the current adventure. Not all class features mind you, but enough that he class isn't useless outside a vessel. </p><p></p><p>>> I'd also want many if not all the flight based benefits to work with flight spells (including polymorphing), riding a flying mount, and using flying magic items (like broomsticks and carpets) as well as vehicles.</p><p></p><p>>> The easy part: Reflex saves are good, acess to a number of skills (I'll wait for 3.5 before making a full list) but incluidng navigation related skills (Now "survivial?") Ride, Pilot, Balance, and a number of other Dex based skills. Decent skill points because, like a rogue, he is dependant on skills for many of his functions. Either a rogue like BAB, or a Fighter like BAB, depending on balence of other class features. Hit Dice at d6, although d8 might work well if we need to up his power a tad for balence.</p><p></p><p>>> It would be easy to tack on the rogue like "reflex save" benefits, then add in some bonus feats limited to mostly flight related feats + some skill focus and a handful or others... but that wouldn't have nearly enough flavor to it in my opinion. We need some unique, or impressive, class features to make the class come alive.</p><p></p><p>>> I don't have many ideas on what those other features would be. Given the class is a Dexterity & Inteligence focued class, witha strong combat lean (because non-adventuring pilots would be simply NPC experts) Maybe INT bonus to AC might work out well, as might some sort of "in the zone" type thing that boosts dexterity for a short term (think dexterity rage).. but now I'm just rehashing features of known core classes. A minor spellcasting progression simply does not fit... anyone got any some other ideas?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="BlackJaw, post: 986088, member: 888"] Back to an old topic. 1) I don't really think it something the game needs, rogues & fighters could fit this bill 9 times out of 10. 2) I don't think most Pilot Classes out there are all that fun or well made. Most are Rogues without rogue abilities or sneak attack, and their class features only work in vehicles. In a standard or quasi-standard game (one where stuff does happen outside a vehicle) the classes are little better then running the NPC class "expert." 3) Most pilot classes are only geared toward flying a vehicle, with little thought to other meathods of flight that some games might have... flying carpets, fly spells, wildshape/polymorph, and flying mounts. 4) People will expect a flight product to have a good pilot (or otherwise flight based) core class, so despite my objections above I do think we need to at least try to come up with one. >> It will need to be functional outside of flying a vehicle and have at least some class features that you can use regularly even if you happen to be underground for the current adventure. Not all class features mind you, but enough that he class isn't useless outside a vessel. >> I'd also want many if not all the flight based benefits to work with flight spells (including polymorphing), riding a flying mount, and using flying magic items (like broomsticks and carpets) as well as vehicles. >> The easy part: Reflex saves are good, acess to a number of skills (I'll wait for 3.5 before making a full list) but incluidng navigation related skills (Now "survivial?") Ride, Pilot, Balance, and a number of other Dex based skills. Decent skill points because, like a rogue, he is dependant on skills for many of his functions. Either a rogue like BAB, or a Fighter like BAB, depending on balence of other class features. Hit Dice at d6, although d8 might work well if we need to up his power a tad for balence. >> It would be easy to tack on the rogue like "reflex save" benefits, then add in some bonus feats limited to mostly flight related feats + some skill focus and a handful or others... but that wouldn't have nearly enough flavor to it in my opinion. We need some unique, or impressive, class features to make the class come alive. >> I don't have many ideas on what those other features would be. Given the class is a Dexterity & Inteligence focued class, witha strong combat lean (because non-adventuring pilots would be simply NPC experts) Maybe INT bonus to AC might work out well, as might some sort of "in the zone" type thing that boosts dexterity for a short term (think dexterity rage).. but now I'm just rehashing features of known core classes. A minor spellcasting progression simply does not fit... anyone got any some other ideas? [/QUOTE]
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