Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
The
VOIDRUNNER'S CODEX
is coming! Explore new worlds, fight oppressive empires, fend off fearsome aliens, and wield deadly psionics with this comprehensive boxed set expansion for 5E and A5E!
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
The roots of 4e exposed?
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="AbdulAlhazred" data-source="post: 7460108" data-attributes="member: 82106"><p>The OSR happened long before 4e became a thing, and wasn't a reaction to it. Honestly I think 'OSR' is overrated anyway as a market force. I have yet to encounter people that actually are in any sense militant about, or even prefer, to play such games. Beyond that there was ALWAYS a certain core of people who thought the 3 1974 LBBs were the last word in RPG design. The term 'Grognard' is NOT new, it was current in at least the 90's and probably the 80's. Anyway, I was playing since the mid 70's and I can tell you that the day 1e hit the shelves there were people who hated on it.</p><p></p><p>So I don't think OSR actually matters. I don't think it appreciably shaped 5e as a distinct movement (maybe the structure of a few options was tweaked to make a more old school type of play a little easier, but 5e is hardly catering to OSR fans anyway). </p><p></p><p>Frankly I think 3.x just wasn't dead yet, and WotC tried to put a stake in it, and the beast just wasn't going to go down. It was also a sort of natural down cycle of D&D, much like the late 80's and the late 90's (note the roughly 10 year cycle). 3.x was getting long in the tooth, but not THAT long. Paizo was created by WotC basically, and it bit them. The market shrank, 'old Coke' was still able to capture almost 50% of it given the marketing and business mistakes that were made, etc. A lack of desire on the part of a decent chunk of people to move on from a game they weren't tired of (but had already bought all their books for) was a big thing, but WotC both created and walked into their own perfect storm.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="AbdulAlhazred, post: 7460108, member: 82106"] The OSR happened long before 4e became a thing, and wasn't a reaction to it. Honestly I think 'OSR' is overrated anyway as a market force. I have yet to encounter people that actually are in any sense militant about, or even prefer, to play such games. Beyond that there was ALWAYS a certain core of people who thought the 3 1974 LBBs were the last word in RPG design. The term 'Grognard' is NOT new, it was current in at least the 90's and probably the 80's. Anyway, I was playing since the mid 70's and I can tell you that the day 1e hit the shelves there were people who hated on it. So I don't think OSR actually matters. I don't think it appreciably shaped 5e as a distinct movement (maybe the structure of a few options was tweaked to make a more old school type of play a little easier, but 5e is hardly catering to OSR fans anyway). Frankly I think 3.x just wasn't dead yet, and WotC tried to put a stake in it, and the beast just wasn't going to go down. It was also a sort of natural down cycle of D&D, much like the late 80's and the late 90's (note the roughly 10 year cycle). 3.x was getting long in the tooth, but not THAT long. Paizo was created by WotC basically, and it bit them. The market shrank, 'old Coke' was still able to capture almost 50% of it given the marketing and business mistakes that were made, etc. A lack of desire on the part of a decent chunk of people to move on from a game they weren't tired of (but had already bought all their books for) was a big thing, but WotC both created and walked into their own perfect storm. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
The roots of 4e exposed?
Top