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<blockquote data-quote="Quickleaf" data-source="post: 7220905" data-attributes="member: 20323"><p>Comparing the <em>jump</em> spell and Champion, you'd think it was 5th <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite2" alt=";)" title="Wink ;)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=";)" /></p><p></p><p>But seriously, that's a good point. There is room in the concept of "warrior" for quite a bit of leeway in interpretation that goes above and beyond what D&D has covered. Sure.</p><p></p><p>And there is a certain <em>type</em> of fighter – a Musketeer / Dread Pirate Roberts type – who fits that highly mobile model very well. </p><p></p><p>But the execution of whatever movement mechanic [MENTION=6801286]Imaculata[/MENTION] was imagining would need to be meaningfully differentiated from the Rogue class in a way that feels "fighter-y."</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I thought about this one a bit further. Another way of rephrasing this in a way that makes sense with 5e rules is "you can move through enemy spaces." That accommodates both the fiction you're aiming for as well as something like "the knight dashes left and right under the dragons legs to attack its wing" or even "the gladiator meets shields with the orc, abruptly spinning around it to slash his scimitar at the nape of its neck."</p><p></p><p>That would be a very powerful ability in certain situations.</p><p></p><p>Ways it might upgrade could be moving through <em>multiple</em> enemies in a turn, mitigating opportunity attacks when moving through enemies (possibly stepping on toes of Mobile feat), or getting pot-shots against an enemy he moves through.</p><p></p><p>Does that feel like it supports multiple concepts of what a fighter is?</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I feel like this idea edges into "defining away creativity" territory. Those sorts of wild ideas – "I surf down the stairs on my shield / the orc" – are best left up to improvisation or narration in play. Trying to codify such unique things specifically can lead to bloat.</p><p></p><p>And some of it feels like it's crossing the DM's side of the screen, so to speak. For example, "taking a stab from an armed enemy on purpose, in order to grab hold of his weapon and put the enemy in a grapple" – that sounds like the kind of thing that a DM might offer spur of the moment (or a player might cajole their DM to agree to). A lot of this "risk for reward" stuff, like the plunging attack example, I've seen handled at the table level; I think the closest the class design comes to incorporating it is the Barbarian's Reckless Attack...</p><p></p><p>...What I could see working is having <strong>Martial Alacrity</strong> (which allows Reaction to be used when you're attacked) be expanded for, say, the <strong>Bravo</strong> or <strong>Gladiator</strong>subclass, so that you can use Martial Alacrity to perform a Grapple once per enemy per short rest. Something along those lines. Similar to how the Thief's Fast Hands expands the Rogue's Cunning Action.</p><p></p><p>"Diving in front of an ally that takes damage, to take the damage for them, even if it is not your turn." – I've incorporated something very similar to this for the Destined Hero subclass.</p><p></p><p>"Swinging by a chandelier, rope, vine to cross a room." – This is the kind of thing where I think any character could potentially do this, so there's actual harm done by codifying it, because it sets precedent for "only characters of X class/subclass/type can swing by chandelier, rope, or vine to cross a room."</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Quickleaf, post: 7220905, member: 20323"] Comparing the [I]jump[/I] spell and Champion, you'd think it was 5th ;) But seriously, that's a good point. There is room in the concept of "warrior" for quite a bit of leeway in interpretation that goes above and beyond what D&D has covered. Sure. And there is a certain [I]type[/I] of fighter – a Musketeer / Dread Pirate Roberts type – who fits that highly mobile model very well. But the execution of whatever movement mechanic [MENTION=6801286]Imaculata[/MENTION] was imagining would need to be meaningfully differentiated from the Rogue class in a way that feels "fighter-y." I thought about this one a bit further. Another way of rephrasing this in a way that makes sense with 5e rules is "you can move through enemy spaces." That accommodates both the fiction you're aiming for as well as something like "the knight dashes left and right under the dragons legs to attack its wing" or even "the gladiator meets shields with the orc, abruptly spinning around it to slash his scimitar at the nape of its neck." That would be a very powerful ability in certain situations. Ways it might upgrade could be moving through [I]multiple[/I] enemies in a turn, mitigating opportunity attacks when moving through enemies (possibly stepping on toes of Mobile feat), or getting pot-shots against an enemy he moves through. Does that feel like it supports multiple concepts of what a fighter is? I feel like this idea edges into "defining away creativity" territory. Those sorts of wild ideas – "I surf down the stairs on my shield / the orc" – are best left up to improvisation or narration in play. Trying to codify such unique things specifically can lead to bloat. And some of it feels like it's crossing the DM's side of the screen, so to speak. For example, "taking a stab from an armed enemy on purpose, in order to grab hold of his weapon and put the enemy in a grapple" – that sounds like the kind of thing that a DM might offer spur of the moment (or a player might cajole their DM to agree to). A lot of this "risk for reward" stuff, like the plunging attack example, I've seen handled at the table level; I think the closest the class design comes to incorporating it is the Barbarian's Reckless Attack... ...What I could see working is having [B]Martial Alacrity[/B] (which allows Reaction to be used when you're attacked) be expanded for, say, the [B]Bravo[/B] or [B]Gladiator[/B]subclass, so that you can use Martial Alacrity to perform a Grapple once per enemy per short rest. Something along those lines. Similar to how the Thief's Fast Hands expands the Rogue's Cunning Action. "Diving in front of an ally that takes damage, to take the damage for them, even if it is not your turn." – I've incorporated something very similar to this for the Destined Hero subclass. "Swinging by a chandelier, rope, vine to cross a room." – This is the kind of thing where I think any character could potentially do this, so there's actual harm done by codifying it, because it sets precedent for "only characters of X class/subclass/type can swing by chandelier, rope, or vine to cross a room." [/QUOTE]
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