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Thing I thought 4e did better: Monsters
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<blockquote data-quote="Manbearcat" data-source="post: 7006763" data-attributes="member: 6696971"><p>The thing is (and I'm sure you realize this) that if you inverted this (which you see happen regularly), it becomes "hugely insensitive" in the other direction:</p><p></p><p>"It only makes sense for the stats (or resolution mechanics) to describe the gameworld."</p><p></p><p>Here we have the implication of nonsense if a game isn't engineered (at least in part if not in whole) as an objective fantasy world process simulator (or causal logic coupler...whatever you want to call it). </p><p></p><p>There isn't an objective "makes sense" when it comes to the TTRPG hobby as a whole. Competing play priorities and intimately personal mental frameworks + cognitive biases drive what "makes sense (to me).". Some folks <strong><em>need </em></strong>things one way to fit their mental framework + cognitive biases ("makes sense") and suit their play priorities. Some folks <strong><em>need </em></strong>it the other way. </p><p></p><p>Other folks still can toggle between the two as the opportunity/compulsion presents itself (and thereby appreciate the very different play priorities and "makes sense-itude" of different systems).</p><p></p><p>But in this case, when [MENTION=42582]pemerton[/MENTION] says "it makes no sense in the 4e context", he isn't being broad and addressing the nature of TTRPG, generally. He isn't gatekeeping or "othering" (which the TTRPG hobby has a long and illustrious history with!). He gives it very specific system context, that of 4e, and provides relevant (and correct) analysis.</p><p></p><p>Now I know there is a robust strain of "system doesn't matter" (because GMs can do whatever they want) thought on these boards. Pemerton is clearly a "system matters" advocate, and he is doing so here...so I guess folks can take offense on those grounds. Perhaps dispute that premise if they'd like? But he isn't telling people what constitutes "making sense" in roleplaying games generally, what constitutes an actual roleplaying game, and whether someone is legitimately roleplaying (so get the hell off his lawn and out of the hobby if you don't agree).</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Manbearcat, post: 7006763, member: 6696971"] The thing is (and I'm sure you realize this) that if you inverted this (which you see happen regularly), it becomes "hugely insensitive" in the other direction: "It only makes sense for the stats (or resolution mechanics) to describe the gameworld." Here we have the implication of nonsense if a game isn't engineered (at least in part if not in whole) as an objective fantasy world process simulator (or causal logic coupler...whatever you want to call it). There isn't an objective "makes sense" when it comes to the TTRPG hobby as a whole. Competing play priorities and intimately personal mental frameworks + cognitive biases drive what "makes sense (to me).". Some folks [B][I]need [/I][/B]things one way to fit their mental framework + cognitive biases ("makes sense") and suit their play priorities. Some folks [B][I]need [/I][/B]it the other way. Other folks still can toggle between the two as the opportunity/compulsion presents itself (and thereby appreciate the very different play priorities and "makes sense-itude" of different systems). But in this case, when [MENTION=42582]pemerton[/MENTION] says "it makes no sense in the 4e context", he isn't being broad and addressing the nature of TTRPG, generally. He isn't gatekeeping or "othering" (which the TTRPG hobby has a long and illustrious history with!). He gives it very specific system context, that of 4e, and provides relevant (and correct) analysis. Now I know there is a robust strain of "system doesn't matter" (because GMs can do whatever they want) thought on these boards. Pemerton is clearly a "system matters" advocate, and he is doing so here...so I guess folks can take offense on those grounds. Perhaps dispute that premise if they'd like? But he isn't telling people what constitutes "making sense" in roleplaying games generally, what constitutes an actual roleplaying game, and whether someone is legitimately roleplaying (so get the hell off his lawn and out of the hobby if you don't agree). [/QUOTE]
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