Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions
Things wrong with 4e: Dragons
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="I'm A Banana" data-source="post: 5892881" data-attributes="member: 2067"><p>"If I can't have exactly what I want, I don't want anything!"? It's your money, I suppose. Seems a little narmed to me, but I guess if WotC can sell you a DDI sub for that month, they'll get your money one way or another. <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite2" alt=";)" title="Wink ;)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=";)" /></p><p></p><p>I think it's the rare player who can't get some use out of contextual information. Like, maybe you're not a white dragon fan, but you see frost giants in your White Dragon entry, and THOSE seem awesome, plus you already have a map for their lair (just use the White Dragon's lair with the serial numbers filed off), complete with traps and hazards like the White Pudding, and rules for blizzards. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>It ain't fluff. It's useful game mechanical information. A blue dragon using <em>Mirage Arcana</em> isn't superfluous description, it's an essential part of using that monster in the game. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>OH BOY MORE PREP WORK! Thanks, Paperwork Fairy! </p><p></p><p>You seem to be missing the point of what I want out of an MM: stuff I can use to play the game. Not prep. Play. </p><p></p><p>When I WANT to do prep, I'm more than capable of removing context for my own diabolical purposes (especially with a handy online tool!). Again, it's pretty basic DM strategy: poach what you want. </p><p></p><p>When I don't want to do prep, a toolbox is useless to me when what I need is a chair, RIGHT NOW, because I'm sitting in front of my players and they are looking at me expectantly and hoping for an exciting adventure.</p><p></p><p>Toolbox is all well and good -- it's perfect DMG and online supplement material. It should absolutely be there. But the game also needs to present me with prefab stuff, and it needs to do this right out the gate, in the core books, because if I'm a newbie DM and I want to run a game tonight, I need to be able to.</p><p></p><p>I should be able to pick up the game (the three core rulebooks) and play the thing that very night if I want to, just by following the instructions on the page.</p><p></p><p>And, I think it's worth mentioning again, this isn't about "fluff vs. crunch." What I miss about dragons in 4e isn't fluff. It's all useful game information, it's just not <em>combat</em> information (4e provides me, well, TOO much info on that front). Since the game is more than combat, I don't think it's asking too much for WotC to provide DMs with more than combat things to do.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="I'm A Banana, post: 5892881, member: 2067"] "If I can't have exactly what I want, I don't want anything!"? It's your money, I suppose. Seems a little narmed to me, but I guess if WotC can sell you a DDI sub for that month, they'll get your money one way or another. ;) I think it's the rare player who can't get some use out of contextual information. Like, maybe you're not a white dragon fan, but you see frost giants in your White Dragon entry, and THOSE seem awesome, plus you already have a map for their lair (just use the White Dragon's lair with the serial numbers filed off), complete with traps and hazards like the White Pudding, and rules for blizzards. It ain't fluff. It's useful game mechanical information. A blue dragon using [I]Mirage Arcana[/I] isn't superfluous description, it's an essential part of using that monster in the game. OH BOY MORE PREP WORK! Thanks, Paperwork Fairy! You seem to be missing the point of what I want out of an MM: stuff I can use to play the game. Not prep. Play. When I WANT to do prep, I'm more than capable of removing context for my own diabolical purposes (especially with a handy online tool!). Again, it's pretty basic DM strategy: poach what you want. When I don't want to do prep, a toolbox is useless to me when what I need is a chair, RIGHT NOW, because I'm sitting in front of my players and they are looking at me expectantly and hoping for an exciting adventure. Toolbox is all well and good -- it's perfect DMG and online supplement material. It should absolutely be there. But the game also needs to present me with prefab stuff, and it needs to do this right out the gate, in the core books, because if I'm a newbie DM and I want to run a game tonight, I need to be able to. I should be able to pick up the game (the three core rulebooks) and play the thing that very night if I want to, just by following the instructions on the page. And, I think it's worth mentioning again, this isn't about "fluff vs. crunch." What I miss about dragons in 4e isn't fluff. It's all useful game information, it's just not [I]combat[/I] information (4e provides me, well, TOO much info on that front). Since the game is more than combat, I don't think it's asking too much for WotC to provide DMs with more than combat things to do. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions
Things wrong with 4e: Dragons
Top