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<blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 6033389" data-attributes="member: 42582"><p>I want a system that recognises what it is that 4e players - or, at least, many of those who post on this forum - do with their game. Which looks nothing like VinylTap's characterisation of it.</p><p></p><p>Some distintive features of 4e inlcude:</p><p></p><p style="margin-left: 20px">* Silo-ing non-combat abilities (many utility and skill powers, rituals, most of the skill system, etc;</p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px">* A robust non-combat conflict resolution system (skill challenges);</p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px">* Clear rules for awarding XP for non-combat encounters and challenges, and for quests, and for time spent in free roleplay, which - together with the combat XP rules - reflect a clear sense of what XP are for (ie progression at the rate of around 1 level per 12 or so hours of dedicated play);</p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px">* Solid rules for adjudicating improvisation, with clear DC guidelines set out by reference to metagame consequences for pacing, flow etc, and supporting crossover between combat and non-combat, such as using skills in combat, and (per PHB p 259 and DMG 2 p 86) using attack powers in non-combat situations.</p><p></p><p>When I look at D&Dnext so far, much of this is missing. There are no guidelines at all for improvised effects, and the DC-setting guidelines only approach the issue from the point of view of ingame difficulty, but not from the metagame point of view of the effect of DCs on pacing and flow. There is no non-combat conflict resolution at all (and traits are crying out for such a system!), nor rules for out-of-combat XP awards. And the skill rules are very fiddly and have a lot of overlap (eg Survival vs Nature Lore; Magical Lore vs Forbidden Lore), though the announced change in the skill mechanic, back to the first iteration, should deal with some of those issues (overlap is less of an issue in a stat-based, more free-descriptor style skill system).</p><p></p><p>In my 4e game, <a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/tabletop-gaming/301282-actual-play-examples-balance-between-fiction-mechanics.html" target="_blank">when the PCs encountered a dire bear and decided to tame it rather than fight it</a>, adjudication and the award of XPs was completely straightforward, and every PC clearly had some way of contributing to the collective endeavour. How would I resolve that in D&Dnext without resort to sheer fiat? How would I make it as exciting, in play, as the combat encounter would be?</p><p></p><p>And that's before we even get to the <a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/d-d-pathfinder/309950-actual-play-my-first-social-only-session.html" target="_blank">more serious, session-dominating social encounters</a> that 4e handles with mechanical ease.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="pemerton, post: 6033389, member: 42582"] I want a system that recognises what it is that 4e players - or, at least, many of those who post on this forum - do with their game. Which looks nothing like VinylTap's characterisation of it. Some distintive features of 4e inlcude: [indent]* Silo-ing non-combat abilities (many utility and skill powers, rituals, most of the skill system, etc; * A robust non-combat conflict resolution system (skill challenges); * Clear rules for awarding XP for non-combat encounters and challenges, and for quests, and for time spent in free roleplay, which - together with the combat XP rules - reflect a clear sense of what XP are for (ie progression at the rate of around 1 level per 12 or so hours of dedicated play); * Solid rules for adjudicating improvisation, with clear DC guidelines set out by reference to metagame consequences for pacing, flow etc, and supporting crossover between combat and non-combat, such as using skills in combat, and (per PHB p 259 and DMG 2 p 86) using attack powers in non-combat situations.[/indent] When I look at D&Dnext so far, much of this is missing. There are no guidelines at all for improvised effects, and the DC-setting guidelines only approach the issue from the point of view of ingame difficulty, but not from the metagame point of view of the effect of DCs on pacing and flow. There is no non-combat conflict resolution at all (and traits are crying out for such a system!), nor rules for out-of-combat XP awards. And the skill rules are very fiddly and have a lot of overlap (eg Survival vs Nature Lore; Magical Lore vs Forbidden Lore), though the announced change in the skill mechanic, back to the first iteration, should deal with some of those issues (overlap is less of an issue in a stat-based, more free-descriptor style skill system). In my 4e game, [url=http://www.enworld.org/forum/tabletop-gaming/301282-actual-play-examples-balance-between-fiction-mechanics.html]when the PCs encountered a dire bear and decided to tame it rather than fight it[/url], adjudication and the award of XPs was completely straightforward, and every PC clearly had some way of contributing to the collective endeavour. How would I resolve that in D&Dnext without resort to sheer fiat? How would I make it as exciting, in play, as the combat encounter would be? And that's before we even get to the [url=http://www.enworld.org/forum/d-d-pathfinder/309950-actual-play-my-first-social-only-session.html]more serious, session-dominating social encounters[/url] that 4e handles with mechanical ease. [/QUOTE]
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