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<blockquote data-quote="AdmundfortGeographer" data-source="post: 5258016" data-attributes="member: 4682"><p>What I was hoping to accomplish was simply have smite go on every attack until the next round. Also simple bookkeeping, but renewed smite got in the way so I thought I had to account for it. Let me know if I'm missing something glaring. <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite1" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":)" /></p><p>I was comparing them side by side. Here is what I saw and felt like evening things out in disparity. My "eyes bugged out" when I compared the effect and duration together. Seems like a serious power-up in comparison.</p><p></p><p><strong>Effect</strong>: <ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul"><em>Pathfinder smite</em>, Cha to attack and level to damage. Extra damage if evil subtype, evil dragon, or undead. Also Cha to AC as deflection. Also, autobypass all target DR. <u>Special</u>: 11th level, expend 2 smites to grant paladin's smite evil effect to all allies within 10 feet for 1 minute. <u>Special</u>: 20th level, smites subject evil outsiders to <em>banishment</em>.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul"><em>Trailblazer smite</em>, Cha to attack and level to damage.</li> </ul><p><em>Comment</em>: Pathfinder smite seriously powered up the smite's effect. Trailblazer's action points can come in to play to add a bit of oomph when needed though.</p><p></p><p><strong>Duration</strong>: <ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul"><em>Pathfinder smite</em>, every attack against target until target dies.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul"><em>Trailblazer smite</em>, single normal attack.</li> </ul><p><em>Comment</em>: Pathfinder lets the smite just go and go and go. Every single attack until dead is simpler bookkeeping of a sort, doesn't wear off with misses. Renewed smite brings parity for the Trailblazer smite so that it doesn't wear off on a miss, but still single attack. Again Trailblazer's action points can help out if a miss occurs before, or a used smite is needed again if APs are left.</p><p></p><p><strong>Frequency</strong>: <ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul"><em>Pathfinder smite</em>, 1/day with +1/day every three levels. Though smite effect doesn't end until target dies.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul"><em>Trailblazer smite</em>, 1/rest with +1/rest every 5 levels.</li> </ul><p><em>Comment</em>: Pathfinder gets +1/... faster than Trailblazer's paladin, and initially that may seem like Pathfinder smite can be used more per combat, but again TB's action points can bring parity here. Trailblazer smite can end up going even further on frequency if the DM offers frequent rests which renew the smites.</p><p></p><p>I know all this is not he be all and end all of the paladin. Here are some areas where I found other differences.</p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Trailblazer gives more skill points per level, and with no cross class cost to skills other skills are cheaper to get. TB's Persuasion includes bluffing.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Trailblazer opened up to four alignments for paladin. (not an ability boost here, just cool).</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Trailblazer adds tower shield to list of proficiencies.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Trailblazer's unified spell chart means paladin's can cast spells a bit earlier than PF, ready a couple spells more at many levels, and at 19th and 20th levels cast 5th level spells. Drawing from the cleric spell list adds many many more spells to select from.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">There was significant overlap between Trailblazer's divine mercy and Pathfinder's mercy ability, yet each could do something the other couldn't.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Pathfinder paladin chooses either the special mount or imbues his weapon. Trailblazer imbues the weapon, losing the special mount class feature all together.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Pathfinder paladin doesn't turn undead but channels either healing to living creatures or damage to undead, but drains lay on hands usage to do it.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Pathfinder paladin has increasingly better aura's some granting DR/evil and extra immunities (11th charm/17th compulsion)</li> </ul><p>Trailblazer steps above the paladin with skills and spells (<- nothing to sneeze at!), and action points bring hard to quantify extra oomph occasionally.</p><p>Pathfinder has more immunities, grants DR, area effect healing bursts, and a boosted smite that does more damage to common smite targets, bypasses target DR, gains deflection to AC, and doesn't run out until target dies.</p><p></p><p>I just felt that smiting could bring a bit of a boost to the TB's smite in comparison.</p><p></p><p>You know, going through all the classes comparing them with each other, I think I've arrived an insight at some design choices to class power.</p><p></p><p>Pathfinder was informed by the 3.x power curve in books (like Complete Champion, the devils and demons monster books) at the final days of 3.x, and brought every 3.x class up to meet the power curve from those books.</p><p>Trailblazer was informed by the 3.x power curve in the core rules, and evened out the classes between each other mostly by bringing up the underpowered classes and bringing down the spellcasting classes.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="AdmundfortGeographer, post: 5258016, member: 4682"] What I was hoping to accomplish was simply have smite go on every attack until the next round. Also simple bookkeeping, but renewed smite got in the way so I thought I had to account for it. Let me know if I'm missing something glaring. :) I was comparing them side by side. Here is what I saw and felt like evening things out in disparity. My "eyes bugged out" when I compared the effect and duration together. Seems like a serious power-up in comparison. [B]Effect[/B]:[LIST] [*][I]Pathfinder smite[/I], Cha to attack and level to damage. Extra damage if evil subtype, evil dragon, or undead. Also Cha to AC as deflection. Also, autobypass all target DR. [U]Special[/U]: 11th level, expend 2 smites to grant paladin's smite evil effect to all allies within 10 feet for 1 minute. [U]Special[/U]: 20th level, smites subject evil outsiders to [I]banishment[/I]. [*][I]Trailblazer smite[/I], Cha to attack and level to damage. [/LIST][I]Comment[/I]: Pathfinder smite seriously powered up the smite's effect. Trailblazer's action points can come in to play to add a bit of oomph when needed though. [B]Duration[/B]:[LIST] [*][I]Pathfinder smite[/I], every attack against target until target dies. [*][I]Trailblazer smite[/I], single normal attack. [/LIST][I]Comment[/I]: Pathfinder lets the smite just go and go and go. Every single attack until dead is simpler bookkeeping of a sort, doesn't wear off with misses. Renewed smite brings parity for the Trailblazer smite so that it doesn't wear off on a miss, but still single attack. Again Trailblazer's action points can help out if a miss occurs before, or a used smite is needed again if APs are left. [B]Frequency[/B]:[LIST] [*][I]Pathfinder smite[/I], 1/day with +1/day every three levels. Though smite effect doesn't end until target dies. [*][I]Trailblazer smite[/I], 1/rest with +1/rest every 5 levels. [/LIST][I]Comment[/I]: Pathfinder gets +1/... faster than Trailblazer's paladin, and initially that may seem like Pathfinder smite can be used more per combat, but again TB's action points can bring parity here. Trailblazer smite can end up going even further on frequency if the DM offers frequent rests which renew the smites. I know all this is not he be all and end all of the paladin. Here are some areas where I found other differences. [LIST][*]Trailblazer gives more skill points per level, and with no cross class cost to skills other skills are cheaper to get. TB's Persuasion includes bluffing. [*]Trailblazer opened up to four alignments for paladin. (not an ability boost here, just cool). [*]Trailblazer adds tower shield to list of proficiencies. [*]Trailblazer's unified spell chart means paladin's can cast spells a bit earlier than PF, ready a couple spells more at many levels, and at 19th and 20th levels cast 5th level spells. Drawing from the cleric spell list adds many many more spells to select from. [*]There was significant overlap between Trailblazer's divine mercy and Pathfinder's mercy ability, yet each could do something the other couldn't. [*]Pathfinder paladin chooses either the special mount or imbues his weapon. Trailblazer imbues the weapon, losing the special mount class feature all together. [*]Pathfinder paladin doesn't turn undead but channels either healing to living creatures or damage to undead, but drains lay on hands usage to do it. [*]Pathfinder paladin has increasingly better aura's some granting DR/evil and extra immunities (11th charm/17th compulsion) [/LIST]Trailblazer steps above the paladin with skills and spells (<- nothing to sneeze at!), and action points bring hard to quantify extra oomph occasionally. Pathfinder has more immunities, grants DR, area effect healing bursts, and a boosted smite that does more damage to common smite targets, bypasses target DR, gains deflection to AC, and doesn't run out until target dies. I just felt that smiting could bring a bit of a boost to the TB's smite in comparison. You know, going through all the classes comparing them with each other, I think I've arrived an insight at some design choices to class power. Pathfinder was informed by the 3.x power curve in books (like Complete Champion, the devils and demons monster books) at the final days of 3.x, and brought every 3.x class up to meet the power curve from those books. Trailblazer was informed by the 3.x power curve in the core rules, and evened out the classes between each other mostly by bringing up the underpowered classes and bringing down the spellcasting classes. [/QUOTE]
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