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*Pathfinder & Starfinder
variant skill list (45+ -> 24)
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<blockquote data-quote="evilbob" data-source="post: 3960090" data-attributes="member: 9789"><p>Good point on the trained/untrained. I've been wondering about that myself, although when I checked the only skill that didn't perfectly align with the trained/untrained rules from the previous skill set was the one you brought up: Legeremain. That one had 2 trained and 1 untrained. So it became trained.</p><p></p><p>Further in the spirit of "no really, I want options not restrictions," I almost threw out trained/untrained altogether because it was simply restricting. I don't want to tell players what they can't do; I want them to be able to do whatever they want - but it just may have a really, really good chance of failing. However, it's still a good theory - the idea that some skills require SOME training before you can really -use- them - so I kept it, but just created a penalty: use any skill you want, but if you're untrained using a trained skill, -5. That seems big enough to hurt, but at the same time not so big it's impossible. The guy with the 20 in Dex? Yeah, he's just so good that it doesn't -matter- that he's never been trained how to pick a lock - he can just work it out as good as some guy who has an 8 in Dex and has 1 point of training. Even if I don't keep anything else from this experiment, I'm definitely keeping this idea.</p><p></p><p>Also, I'd like to point out that while all of Crafting has been reduced to 1 skill, it's also -hard-. I made it trained - one of the only actual changes re: trained/untrained - so your average guy can't just make leather armor or spoons or whatever without some basic training. On the other hand, a level 2 guy with only 10 Int who's maxed it out can take a 10 on his crafting rolls to create armor or clothes or any mundane, normal item. I think it's pretty fair, but again feedback is welcome.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="evilbob, post: 3960090, member: 9789"] Good point on the trained/untrained. I've been wondering about that myself, although when I checked the only skill that didn't perfectly align with the trained/untrained rules from the previous skill set was the one you brought up: Legeremain. That one had 2 trained and 1 untrained. So it became trained. Further in the spirit of "no really, I want options not restrictions," I almost threw out trained/untrained altogether because it was simply restricting. I don't want to tell players what they can't do; I want them to be able to do whatever they want - but it just may have a really, really good chance of failing. However, it's still a good theory - the idea that some skills require SOME training before you can really -use- them - so I kept it, but just created a penalty: use any skill you want, but if you're untrained using a trained skill, -5. That seems big enough to hurt, but at the same time not so big it's impossible. The guy with the 20 in Dex? Yeah, he's just so good that it doesn't -matter- that he's never been trained how to pick a lock - he can just work it out as good as some guy who has an 8 in Dex and has 1 point of training. Even if I don't keep anything else from this experiment, I'm definitely keeping this idea. Also, I'd like to point out that while all of Crafting has been reduced to 1 skill, it's also -hard-. I made it trained - one of the only actual changes re: trained/untrained - so your average guy can't just make leather armor or spoons or whatever without some basic training. On the other hand, a level 2 guy with only 10 Int who's maxed it out can take a 10 on his crafting rolls to create armor or clothes or any mundane, normal item. I think it's pretty fair, but again feedback is welcome. [/QUOTE]
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