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Wandering Monsters 01/29/2014:Level Advancement...
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<blockquote data-quote="howandwhy99" data-source="post: 6255515" data-attributes="member: 3192"><p>Whether you intend it or not, this appears like an argument by dilemma for never using XP. Story path games are going to be affected by games that pre-set a specific level of advancement. Events must happen in order and PCs must be at an effective level to participate in them. By using XP as a Story Reward only most Pathfinder DMs already sidestep this horn of the dilemma. Publishers who create adventure path adventures should specify exactly what kind of XP they are using for this reason. XP that is gained by players by learning via game play or XP gained by moving through the events of the storyline. Adventure publishers who want to do both might look at Necromancer Games' <em>W1 The Crucible of Freya </em>for a very early sketch of how this might be done.</p><p></p><p>I'll argue this isn't another horn of the dilemma, but mistaking player goals as immutably set by the game rules. Players can go through the castle to save the princess, and if they could succeed taking this harder path they would gain greater XP. If they simply teleported in, they also would gain XP, but far less. However, they would also have the princess at far less cost. The belief that D&D players only ever seek to gain XP or kills is a false prejudice held by many who have come to hate D&D over the years. It's not something supported by the game's design.</p><p></p><p>Also the above is why gold, treasure, and all of the game resources of D&D not part of class abilities aren't balanced for or distributed to PCs, but rather to dungeon levels. You can seek those out instead of advancing in your class. And while the princess may be valuable to your current goals, players change goals as their learning of the situation changes. Like when they storm the front gates and find rooms of other slaves within. </p><p></p><p>Tainted is a strong word. People are thinking wrong when they come to play isn't a great opener. Instead, I think it's important for any game to define its rules clearly as well as its objectives. </p><p></p><p>For the case of D&D, I think it may be about putting players in a position to create, plan, and realize their own goals in an imaginary environment within the limits of a role. So XP is not a reward at all, but rather another stat. One measuring a player's actual demonstration of their proficiency in playing the role (class) they've chosen within the game. Unlike rolled stats this one must be proven by the player through play. Of course, XP doesn't necessarily represent a player's actual game ability, only the demonstrated ability within the current game (campaign). But XP isn't a reward or a badge of some sort; it's only an estimation of player skill. In this way it might be thought of as a handicap in bowling.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="howandwhy99, post: 6255515, member: 3192"] Whether you intend it or not, this appears like an argument by dilemma for never using XP. Story path games are going to be affected by games that pre-set a specific level of advancement. Events must happen in order and PCs must be at an effective level to participate in them. By using XP as a Story Reward only most Pathfinder DMs already sidestep this horn of the dilemma. Publishers who create adventure path adventures should specify exactly what kind of XP they are using for this reason. XP that is gained by players by learning via game play or XP gained by moving through the events of the storyline. Adventure publishers who want to do both might look at Necromancer Games' [I]W1 The Crucible of Freya [/I]for a very early sketch of how this might be done. I'll argue this isn't another horn of the dilemma, but mistaking player goals as immutably set by the game rules. Players can go through the castle to save the princess, and if they could succeed taking this harder path they would gain greater XP. If they simply teleported in, they also would gain XP, but far less. However, they would also have the princess at far less cost. The belief that D&D players only ever seek to gain XP or kills is a false prejudice held by many who have come to hate D&D over the years. It's not something supported by the game's design. Also the above is why gold, treasure, and all of the game resources of D&D not part of class abilities aren't balanced for or distributed to PCs, but rather to dungeon levels. You can seek those out instead of advancing in your class. And while the princess may be valuable to your current goals, players change goals as their learning of the situation changes. Like when they storm the front gates and find rooms of other slaves within. Tainted is a strong word. People are thinking wrong when they come to play isn't a great opener. Instead, I think it's important for any game to define its rules clearly as well as its objectives. For the case of D&D, I think it may be about putting players in a position to create, plan, and realize their own goals in an imaginary environment within the limits of a role. So XP is not a reward at all, but rather another stat. One measuring a player's actual demonstration of their proficiency in playing the role (class) they've chosen within the game. Unlike rolled stats this one must be proven by the player through play. Of course, XP doesn't necessarily represent a player's actual game ability, only the demonstrated ability within the current game (campaign). But XP isn't a reward or a badge of some sort; it's only an estimation of player skill. In this way it might be thought of as a handicap in bowling. [/QUOTE]
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