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<blockquote data-quote="Lylandra" data-source="post: 7307482" data-attributes="member: 6816692"><p>Wow, thanks for the preview. Didn't expect to see a first draft so soon.</p><p></p><p>Overall: Good job. I'm really looking forward to see the AP come to life again <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite1" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":)" /></p><p></p><p>Still, you asked for feedback, so I'll give it a try. First, I'm not really a 5e expert when it comes to actual experience with the edition, so I'll leave the balance fine-tuning to someone else and provide more general thoughts. </p><p></p><p>For the rules:</p><p></p><p><strong>Backgrounds</strong>: Using the old Gate Pass feats as new backgrounds is a sound idea, but I don't know if it is the best one. Originally, the feats were pure bonus for players who chose to integrate their character into Gate Pass (thus making the DM's life easier). Now they are replacing one concrete feature of character creation and I don't know if too many players would actually take them. </p><p></p><p>I also don't know if every Gate Pass background feat has enough meat on its bones to warrant being a full 5e background which symbolizes the origins of a character. And "festival organizer", for example, doesn't provide with a complete origin that evokes a story. Others, like Guild sympathizer, are fluff-wise simply another version of the criminal background with different benefits. </p><p></p><p>Oh and one thought, if you wish to keep that one as background: the War Mage really needs something else than the Sage in the skills/languages/proficiencies section. Gabal's school is all about stance, physical posture, discipline etc. and not so much a typical bookish wizard school. </p><p></p><p>Now having WotBS specific backgrounds is a neat idea. But maybe they'd work better as general backgrounds from all over the world. When I read through other groups' campaigns (and thinking of my own group), players are seldom simply humans born and raised in Gate Pass. They wish to play a Shahalesti elf or a Dasseni dwarf veteran or a Innenotdar or Taranesti survivor or maybe even a Ragesian rogue inquisitor or a monk from the monastery of the two winds. Question is, which character background warrants a fully fleshed out background option?</p><p></p><p><strong>Feats:</strong> As I said, I am no expert in 5e balance, so take my feedback in this section with a grain of salt. </p><p></p><p>What I found a bit unusual were the prerequesites of the feats. The leader feats have more demanding prereqs in comparison to other 5e feats and if I remember correctly, 5e abandoned any kind of feat chain and players seldomly use more than 2-3 feats. </p><p></p><p>As a quick thought, I'd cut the "ability to cast shocking grasp" from the East Wind Style feat, even if it fits thematically. The spell itself is never used within the feat's application. </p><p></p><p>For the leader feats, I'd consider using the PHB feat Inspiring Leader as entry point. I don't really know whether the feat is considered strong or weak, but the Leadership Performance feat is definitely stronger. Plus Legendary Leader basically incorporates the effect of the Inspiring Leader feat. I'd also let Leadership Performance be entirely CHA-based. I don't see a reason why all casters should have an innate advantage on leading their allies over martial characters. </p><p></p><p>I'm not sure whether Iron-Willed Leader is worth taking for it is really situational to use. Necrotic Leader and Primal Leader are too weak without adding an ability score increase. In addition, you could consider baking them into one. </p><p></p><p><strong>Commander:</strong></p><p>First, I really, really like it that this class became a fighter archetype. </p><p></p><p>What I did find quite odd however was that Widen Command also applies to a feat, Leadership Performance, which is purely optional (and there are groups out there who play without allowing feats at all). As I'd say the Commander might not be the strongest archetype, maybe giving it the effects of Leadership Performance as feature might help. Especially as I'd say that Implicit Command feels kind of weak considering the fact that basically everyone in WotBS speaks common and the feature doesn't remove the INT 3 restriction. </p><p></p><p><strong>Wayfarer Cirqueliste:</strong></p><p>I really don't know if you want to open the Pandora's Box that is Prestige Classes and release it onto 5e. I assume you didn't know whether the WC would be better suited for bard or for sorcerer as a starting class and it was kind of unique to WotBS. I also understand that you don't want to make it a class of its own as the flair of the WC was that story-wise you could just join the Wayfarers and go for it. </p><p>But I'd really consider making the WC a bard "college", considering the fact that former PrCs Arcane Archer and Eldritch Knight are both fighter archetypes despite the latter having a spellcasting progression of their own. Maybe start with giving it misty step as bonus spell known and give it your suggested list of WC spells as additional spells known option. </p><p></p><p><strong>Gabal's superior missile:</strong> The way it is right now would make it 100% superior (hehe) to Magic Missile. If this was your intention - maybe as a benefit for joining Gabal's school, then mission accomplished. </p><p></p><p>For the Fluff:</p><p></p><p>The 4e player's guide has some added details that could be considered adding to the 5e PG. </p><p></p><p>First, it has a section on the eight temples or shrines of the eight gods plus some priests running it. There is also a neat myth on what really sparked the Resistance against Coaltongue. </p><p>While you could always change the names (other than Burun Watcher and Biggs they are never mentioned again), giving the temples at least names and suggestions for the corresponding god's portfolios will help aspiring divine characters. When I started the campaign, I didn't bother to look for the 4e material first and had to put up everything on my own when it came to Divine stuff (a pantheon etc.) besides the four Spirits. Maybe even add a "sample pantheon" (for example, there was a Red Archer mentioned in the Prologue) for those who don't want to bother inserting one of their own. </p><p></p><p>Then there is a section on races (where they can come, how other people see them etc.) from which is always useful for players. I don't know if you wish to integrate all PHB races - the 4e version did this, but had some strange side effects on the campaign as Dragonborn felt tucked on despite having the opportunity to weave them into the Elemental Myth or connect them with the existing dragons. But maybe consider stressing out that Shahalesti view High Elves as superior and that all noble Shahalesti are High Elves or that Drow are... basically unheard of which is why playing one needs extra considerations etc.</p><p></p><p>The section on the other lands of the setting is also slightly more detailed and includes the Wayfarers (which is not a bad idea when you wish to integrate the Cirqueliste into the PG). There are some sections which you'd like to leave out like the relationship of the old Khagan with a tribe of Dragonborn, but adding at least something about Ostalin (yep, my players also asked me "what about Ostalin?" right at the beginning) should be worth it, especially if many half-elves stem from there.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Lylandra, post: 7307482, member: 6816692"] Wow, thanks for the preview. Didn't expect to see a first draft so soon. Overall: Good job. I'm really looking forward to see the AP come to life again :) Still, you asked for feedback, so I'll give it a try. First, I'm not really a 5e expert when it comes to actual experience with the edition, so I'll leave the balance fine-tuning to someone else and provide more general thoughts. For the rules: [B]Backgrounds[/B]: Using the old Gate Pass feats as new backgrounds is a sound idea, but I don't know if it is the best one. Originally, the feats were pure bonus for players who chose to integrate their character into Gate Pass (thus making the DM's life easier). Now they are replacing one concrete feature of character creation and I don't know if too many players would actually take them. I also don't know if every Gate Pass background feat has enough meat on its bones to warrant being a full 5e background which symbolizes the origins of a character. And "festival organizer", for example, doesn't provide with a complete origin that evokes a story. Others, like Guild sympathizer, are fluff-wise simply another version of the criminal background with different benefits. Oh and one thought, if you wish to keep that one as background: the War Mage really needs something else than the Sage in the skills/languages/proficiencies section. Gabal's school is all about stance, physical posture, discipline etc. and not so much a typical bookish wizard school. Now having WotBS specific backgrounds is a neat idea. But maybe they'd work better as general backgrounds from all over the world. When I read through other groups' campaigns (and thinking of my own group), players are seldom simply humans born and raised in Gate Pass. They wish to play a Shahalesti elf or a Dasseni dwarf veteran or a Innenotdar or Taranesti survivor or maybe even a Ragesian rogue inquisitor or a monk from the monastery of the two winds. Question is, which character background warrants a fully fleshed out background option? [B]Feats:[/B] As I said, I am no expert in 5e balance, so take my feedback in this section with a grain of salt. What I found a bit unusual were the prerequesites of the feats. The leader feats have more demanding prereqs in comparison to other 5e feats and if I remember correctly, 5e abandoned any kind of feat chain and players seldomly use more than 2-3 feats. As a quick thought, I'd cut the "ability to cast shocking grasp" from the East Wind Style feat, even if it fits thematically. The spell itself is never used within the feat's application. For the leader feats, I'd consider using the PHB feat Inspiring Leader as entry point. I don't really know whether the feat is considered strong or weak, but the Leadership Performance feat is definitely stronger. Plus Legendary Leader basically incorporates the effect of the Inspiring Leader feat. I'd also let Leadership Performance be entirely CHA-based. I don't see a reason why all casters should have an innate advantage on leading their allies over martial characters. I'm not sure whether Iron-Willed Leader is worth taking for it is really situational to use. Necrotic Leader and Primal Leader are too weak without adding an ability score increase. In addition, you could consider baking them into one. [B]Commander:[/B] First, I really, really like it that this class became a fighter archetype. What I did find quite odd however was that Widen Command also applies to a feat, Leadership Performance, which is purely optional (and there are groups out there who play without allowing feats at all). As I'd say the Commander might not be the strongest archetype, maybe giving it the effects of Leadership Performance as feature might help. Especially as I'd say that Implicit Command feels kind of weak considering the fact that basically everyone in WotBS speaks common and the feature doesn't remove the INT 3 restriction. [B]Wayfarer Cirqueliste:[/B] I really don't know if you want to open the Pandora's Box that is Prestige Classes and release it onto 5e. I assume you didn't know whether the WC would be better suited for bard or for sorcerer as a starting class and it was kind of unique to WotBS. I also understand that you don't want to make it a class of its own as the flair of the WC was that story-wise you could just join the Wayfarers and go for it. But I'd really consider making the WC a bard "college", considering the fact that former PrCs Arcane Archer and Eldritch Knight are both fighter archetypes despite the latter having a spellcasting progression of their own. Maybe start with giving it misty step as bonus spell known and give it your suggested list of WC spells as additional spells known option. [B]Gabal's superior missile:[/B] The way it is right now would make it 100% superior (hehe) to Magic Missile. If this was your intention - maybe as a benefit for joining Gabal's school, then mission accomplished. For the Fluff: The 4e player's guide has some added details that could be considered adding to the 5e PG. First, it has a section on the eight temples or shrines of the eight gods plus some priests running it. There is also a neat myth on what really sparked the Resistance against Coaltongue. While you could always change the names (other than Burun Watcher and Biggs they are never mentioned again), giving the temples at least names and suggestions for the corresponding god's portfolios will help aspiring divine characters. When I started the campaign, I didn't bother to look for the 4e material first and had to put up everything on my own when it came to Divine stuff (a pantheon etc.) besides the four Spirits. Maybe even add a "sample pantheon" (for example, there was a Red Archer mentioned in the Prologue) for those who don't want to bother inserting one of their own. Then there is a section on races (where they can come, how other people see them etc.) from which is always useful for players. I don't know if you wish to integrate all PHB races - the 4e version did this, but had some strange side effects on the campaign as Dragonborn felt tucked on despite having the opportunity to weave them into the Elemental Myth or connect them with the existing dragons. But maybe consider stressing out that Shahalesti view High Elves as superior and that all noble Shahalesti are High Elves or that Drow are... basically unheard of which is why playing one needs extra considerations etc. The section on the other lands of the setting is also slightly more detailed and includes the Wayfarers (which is not a bad idea when you wish to integrate the Cirqueliste into the PG). There are some sections which you'd like to leave out like the relationship of the old Khagan with a tribe of Dragonborn, but adding at least something about Ostalin (yep, my players also asked me "what about Ostalin?" right at the beginning) should be worth it, especially if many half-elves stem from there. [/QUOTE]
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