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Warden L6 Utility "Bears Endurance"
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<blockquote data-quote="Gryph" data-source="post: 5723956" data-attributes="member: 98071"><p>From a practical standpoint at the table, I agree. I was referring to character/narrative view of not turning back time</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>What happens when you are hit? </p><p></p><p>You resolve the effects of being hit (calculate and apply damage, apply riders, etc).</p><p></p><p>An Immediate Interrupt jumps in when its trigger occurs, taking place before the trigger <strong>finishes</strong>. If an interrupt invalidates a triggering action, the triggering action is lost. From the rules compendium page 195.</p><p></p><p>The first sentence seems pretty clear to me that interrupts happen after the triggering event has happened. It then "jumps in" suspending the resolution of the trigger. </p><p></p><p>To me the second sentence means, after the interrupt is finished, reevaluate the trigger, if it is no longer valid because of the interrupt effect, the triggering action is lost.</p><p></p><p>So at the table Shield looks like this:</p><p></p><p>DM: The Ogre bashes you with his club (rolls) 22 vs AC, I believe that hits. (starts to roll damage to resolve the hit)</p><p></p><p>Wizard PC: I'm going to use Shield my AC is now 23</p><p></p><p>DM: Ok, your Shield manifests absorbing the Ogre's blow (last bit is pure narrative fluff).</p><p></p><p>If you believe that comparing the attack to defense is the completion of resolving "You are hit" then your interpretation is correct and the Interrupt has to happen before the trigger. I believe the verbiage of the interrupt rule quoted above requires that we shoehorn an interrupt in between the trigger occurrence and the effects of that occurrence. Play it how ever you like at your table.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Page 215 of the Compendium: (enumerated steps of making an attack)</p><p></p><p>5. When an attacks hits, it usually deals damage, and many attacks produce some other effect, such as forced movement or a condition. An attack power's description specifies what happens on a hit. Most attack powers do nothing on a miss, but some specify an effect such as half damage, on a miss.</p><p></p><p>So, the consequences of taking the damage, unless specified by the attack's power description, are not part of resolving the attack. Therefore the trigger "you drop to 0 hit points or fewer" happens after the attack has finished resolving and it can't invalidate the attack. You are dying and your opponent is stunned. </p><p></p><p>If the trigger were "you take damage" then the attack power, which specifies the damage in its description, would not have finished resolving so the interrupt would stun the opponent, and the stun would invalidate the attack, because a stunned creature can't take an action.</p><p></p><p>Page 260 of the Compendium (Dying and Death)</p><p></p><p>Dying: When an adventurer's hit points drop to 0 or fewer, he or she falls unconscious and is dying.</p><p></p><p>This reads to me as a clear event and resolution sequence. You drop to 0 or fewer hit points, you fall unconscious, you are dying.</p><p></p><p>With You drop to 0 or fewer hit points as a trigger, the interrupt fits into the sequence between dropping to 0 or fewer hit points and you fall unconscious. If the result of the trigger is you are no longer below zero hit points you don't fall unconscious.</p><p></p><p>Again, feel free to interpret the above rules differently but stop telling me my interpretation is wrong. It is a perfectly valid interpretation of the quoted rules.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Gryph, post: 5723956, member: 98071"] From a practical standpoint at the table, I agree. I was referring to character/narrative view of not turning back time What happens when you are hit? You resolve the effects of being hit (calculate and apply damage, apply riders, etc). An Immediate Interrupt jumps in when its trigger occurs, taking place before the trigger [B]finishes[/B]. If an interrupt invalidates a triggering action, the triggering action is lost. From the rules compendium page 195. The first sentence seems pretty clear to me that interrupts happen after the triggering event has happened. It then "jumps in" suspending the resolution of the trigger. To me the second sentence means, after the interrupt is finished, reevaluate the trigger, if it is no longer valid because of the interrupt effect, the triggering action is lost. So at the table Shield looks like this: DM: The Ogre bashes you with his club (rolls) 22 vs AC, I believe that hits. (starts to roll damage to resolve the hit) Wizard PC: I'm going to use Shield my AC is now 23 DM: Ok, your Shield manifests absorbing the Ogre's blow (last bit is pure narrative fluff). If you believe that comparing the attack to defense is the completion of resolving "You are hit" then your interpretation is correct and the Interrupt has to happen before the trigger. I believe the verbiage of the interrupt rule quoted above requires that we shoehorn an interrupt in between the trigger occurrence and the effects of that occurrence. Play it how ever you like at your table. Page 215 of the Compendium: (enumerated steps of making an attack) 5. When an attacks hits, it usually deals damage, and many attacks produce some other effect, such as forced movement or a condition. An attack power's description specifies what happens on a hit. Most attack powers do nothing on a miss, but some specify an effect such as half damage, on a miss. So, the consequences of taking the damage, unless specified by the attack's power description, are not part of resolving the attack. Therefore the trigger "you drop to 0 hit points or fewer" happens after the attack has finished resolving and it can't invalidate the attack. You are dying and your opponent is stunned. If the trigger were "you take damage" then the attack power, which specifies the damage in its description, would not have finished resolving so the interrupt would stun the opponent, and the stun would invalidate the attack, because a stunned creature can't take an action. Page 260 of the Compendium (Dying and Death) Dying: When an adventurer's hit points drop to 0 or fewer, he or she falls unconscious and is dying. This reads to me as a clear event and resolution sequence. You drop to 0 or fewer hit points, you fall unconscious, you are dying. With You drop to 0 or fewer hit points as a trigger, the interrupt fits into the sequence between dropping to 0 or fewer hit points and you fall unconscious. If the result of the trigger is you are no longer below zero hit points you don't fall unconscious. Again, feel free to interpret the above rules differently but stop telling me my interpretation is wrong. It is a perfectly valid interpretation of the quoted rules. [/QUOTE]
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Warden L6 Utility "Bears Endurance"
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