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General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Warlord as a Fighter option; Assassin as a Rogue option
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<blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 6047388" data-attributes="member: 42582"><p>I don't think that's true. Feints, lures, etc force movement without the application of physical force.</p><p></p><p>It's a distinction that the game doesn't draw in myriad other places where it might. For example, the game doesn't simulate DEX-based "finesse" fighting via the sort of process you are decribing here. The finesse fighter simply gets to add a bonus to his/her attacks. Forced movement is the same logic, only applied to positioning rather than to attack rolls.</p><p></p><p>This was the point of my comparison, upthread, with zone-based combat. If positioning in D&D was abstracted into zones, in the same sort of way that attacks are abstracted, then I think no one would object to warlord forced movement. But D&D uses non-abstract positioning, and hence needs forced movement to permit feints and trickery to occur within the game on a reliable basis.</p><p></p><p>D&D highly regulates that actions my PC can take, especially in a combat round! It certainly doesn't rely on free narration.</p><p></p><p>A week or two ago you had a thread in which you posed the question of whether free roleplaying was a satisfactory way to resolve combat. Your implied answer to the question was (to my reading, at least) no.</p><p></p><p>The same arguments that apply to that case, apply to this one too. If I want to play a battlefield commander, relying on free roleplaying to trick the NPCs and monsters is not satisfactory. It makes action resolution for my PC essentially a matter of GM fiat.</p><p></p><p>Who is saying this? If people want to build fighters and rogues and then free-roleplay the GM into tricks, go to town! If people want to build warlords (or cavaliers or whatever they end up being called) and choose only the non-forced-movement abilities, go to town! I'm not stopping them.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="pemerton, post: 6047388, member: 42582"] I don't think that's true. Feints, lures, etc force movement without the application of physical force. It's a distinction that the game doesn't draw in myriad other places where it might. For example, the game doesn't simulate DEX-based "finesse" fighting via the sort of process you are decribing here. The finesse fighter simply gets to add a bonus to his/her attacks. Forced movement is the same logic, only applied to positioning rather than to attack rolls. This was the point of my comparison, upthread, with zone-based combat. If positioning in D&D was abstracted into zones, in the same sort of way that attacks are abstracted, then I think no one would object to warlord forced movement. But D&D uses non-abstract positioning, and hence needs forced movement to permit feints and trickery to occur within the game on a reliable basis. D&D highly regulates that actions my PC can take, especially in a combat round! It certainly doesn't rely on free narration. A week or two ago you had a thread in which you posed the question of whether free roleplaying was a satisfactory way to resolve combat. Your implied answer to the question was (to my reading, at least) no. The same arguments that apply to that case, apply to this one too. If I want to play a battlefield commander, relying on free roleplaying to trick the NPCs and monsters is not satisfactory. It makes action resolution for my PC essentially a matter of GM fiat. Who is saying this? If people want to build fighters and rogues and then free-roleplay the GM into tricks, go to town! If people want to build warlords (or cavaliers or whatever they end up being called) and choose only the non-forced-movement abilities, go to town! I'm not stopping them. [/QUOTE]
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Warlord as a Fighter option; Assassin as a Rogue option
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