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What DM flaw has caused you to actually leave a game?
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<blockquote data-quote="Hussar" data-source="post: 7506989" data-attributes="member: 22779"><p>Ok, caught up. Yeesh, lots of posts. <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite8" alt=":D" title="Big grin :D" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":D" /></p><p></p><p>Let's take a fairly clear example - an Oath of Devotion Paladin. Now, what is the actual effect of the player Backgrounding his oath? The player has now clearly told the DM that he does not want his Oath to be a focus of play. But, what does that mean?</p><p></p><p>Well, IMO, that means that the DM would not bring in elements into play which test that Paladin's Oath. So, no "orc babies", no "your church is actually run by cultists", that sort of thing. The campaign progresses pretty much exactly like it normally would, just that this one specific element - i.e. the Paladin's Oath - is not the focus. So, the paladin gets to be the shining hero, which is likely the concept for an Oath Paladin, and on we go.</p><p></p><p>What's the problem here?</p><p></p><p>Or, let's roll back to a Warlock. The Warlock player places his Patron in the Background. So, what changes at the table? Again, the DM is instructed to leave that bit out of the game. So, the Patron might ask for minor stuff that can be handled in the background (someone earlier mentioned passing messages for Correlon (I know, cleric, not warlock but the principle is the same), and you might even have some contact between the Patron and the warlock, but, again, this will never be the focus of play. So, essentially, that "NPC" (I'm not really sure if patrons count as NPC's or not) fades into the background and play continues.</p><p></p><p>Again, what is the problem here? </p><p></p><p>The player has clearly, in no uncertain terms, told you his or her preferences. They couldn't be more clear. Wouldn't it be an incredibly dick move to ignore that? Regardless of whether or not this featured in a game, a player that comes to me and says, "I have NO interest in X, I do not want to do X, it is not fun." isn't doing anything wrong. I'd LOVE it if players would be that forthcoming. Hell, usually getting any sort of feedback from players is like pulling teeth. </p><p></p><p>Honestly, I'm really struggling to see how this isn't just a DM ego thing. I know that's not nice to say, but, I can't see any other interpretation. You have the entire game world to play with. The player has told you that they do not like X and have no interest in X. How arrogant do you have to be to ignore that and go ahead and do X in spite of the player?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Hussar, post: 7506989, member: 22779"] Ok, caught up. Yeesh, lots of posts. :D Let's take a fairly clear example - an Oath of Devotion Paladin. Now, what is the actual effect of the player Backgrounding his oath? The player has now clearly told the DM that he does not want his Oath to be a focus of play. But, what does that mean? Well, IMO, that means that the DM would not bring in elements into play which test that Paladin's Oath. So, no "orc babies", no "your church is actually run by cultists", that sort of thing. The campaign progresses pretty much exactly like it normally would, just that this one specific element - i.e. the Paladin's Oath - is not the focus. So, the paladin gets to be the shining hero, which is likely the concept for an Oath Paladin, and on we go. What's the problem here? Or, let's roll back to a Warlock. The Warlock player places his Patron in the Background. So, what changes at the table? Again, the DM is instructed to leave that bit out of the game. So, the Patron might ask for minor stuff that can be handled in the background (someone earlier mentioned passing messages for Correlon (I know, cleric, not warlock but the principle is the same), and you might even have some contact between the Patron and the warlock, but, again, this will never be the focus of play. So, essentially, that "NPC" (I'm not really sure if patrons count as NPC's or not) fades into the background and play continues. Again, what is the problem here? The player has clearly, in no uncertain terms, told you his or her preferences. They couldn't be more clear. Wouldn't it be an incredibly dick move to ignore that? Regardless of whether or not this featured in a game, a player that comes to me and says, "I have NO interest in X, I do not want to do X, it is not fun." isn't doing anything wrong. I'd LOVE it if players would be that forthcoming. Hell, usually getting any sort of feedback from players is like pulling teeth. Honestly, I'm really struggling to see how this isn't just a DM ego thing. I know that's not nice to say, but, I can't see any other interpretation. You have the entire game world to play with. The player has told you that they do not like X and have no interest in X. How arrogant do you have to be to ignore that and go ahead and do X in spite of the player? [/QUOTE]
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