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What is player agency to you?
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<blockquote data-quote="Oofta" data-source="post: 9072164" data-attributes="member: 6801845"><p>There's a lot here, most of which doesn't seem to really relate to player agency. But my definition? The player feels like they can influence the world around them, that their choices matter, that in most cases they can make decisions based on information and details that help them make those decisions. </p><p></p><p>In other words, they want to feel like what they say and do matter. Doesn't mean things will always go their way, but if it doesn't there should be an in-world reason. If they were fed false information, it should make sense why they were given this false information and ideally get a chance at payback. They don't need to make major changes to the world outside of what their PC does, but they do need to feel a decent amount of freedom to act as they see fit. I do put some limits on behavior, for example I wouldn't enjoy running a game for evil PCs so I explain that during our session 0.</p><p></p><p>So in my games I give people options, it's why I don't do modules. Instead I define interesting locations, factions and actors along with their motivations and goals. I point the group in a direction to start but from there I just put out options and rumors. At the end of a session, they get to decide what they pursue next if they aren't in the middle of something and we go from there. If they heard a rumor of people being drained of blood then I'll have to think about what happens because they didn't go after that vampire, if anything. The world exists outside of the PCs and can be affected by their actions and inactions.</p><p></p><p>That's not the only way to run a game of course, especially for a more short term game or a game for new players. But even in a more directed game you can still give people choices. I recently started a new campaign for newbies and it's pretty directed - they're all working for an organization and given assignments. But they are still given a list of potential leads with the general direction being "figure out what's going on". Do they decide to make an alliance with the local wererat guild because the wererats make great spies? Do some optional little side quests like help a little girl crying on the street? Because the former may come back to bite them while the latter is not really what it seems but could ultimately be very beneficial.</p><p></p><p>In any case on to other issues...</p><p></p><p><strong>"In my Classic Old School Hard Fun Killer DM Railroad Tycoon Unfair Unbalanced Style." </strong></p><p>Umm ... okay. So basically you are not going to tailor your style <em>at all</em> to what the players want. "Classic Old School Hard Fun Killer DM" is just not going to work for a lot of people. Even if this is only a short term game some people want to become invested in their PCs. </p><p></p><p><strong>"I'm not a fan of the players or characters. And the big part of this for me is I don't give out advice or help to the players ever. " </strong></p><p>You never help people out, so <em>of course</em> they're going to get frustrated. They don't have a friggin' clue as to what their PC can do or not do, so you just punish them with instant death when they jump into that lava that as a player they have no way of possibly knowing how deadly it's going to be. No wonder they feel like they are just pawns in your game. It's not telling the player what to do, it's giving the information their PC should have in order to make an informed decision. "You can jump in the Pool of Deadly Lava if you want, but as far as you can tell it will be suicidal" is not telling the player what to do.</p><p></p><p>I help people, especially newbies, on a regular basis because they can't read my mind. They likely don't know how I run skill checks or what their PC is physically capable of. I even help more experienced players if they're stuck, I give them options and suggestions because maybe I wasn't clear or it's something I think should be obvious to the PC, if not the player.</p><p></p><p><strong>"My game is loaded with lore and information. It's one of my favorite things. Even the player that just coasts through the game will have to go through a little."</strong></p><p>I think someone else mentioned this. I can either play or I can take notes. In addition, my PC is living in this world and in many cases it's a matter of life and death. Me? As a player? It's something I do for fun now and then. I don't want it to be like studying for a pop quiz. That, and honestly? Most casual players don't really care much about your lore, especially for a short term campaign. I create a lot of lore myself and some people really dig into it, others not so much. I don't punish the latter because they aren't a fan of my amateur hour fantasy fan-fic. </p><p></p><p>If my players have to make a decision based on lore I've dumped I'll just remind them of the pertinent information. </p><p></p><p>Since this is not your regular group I'd suggest you try to meet the players halfway. You can have a directed campaign without being a complete railroad, even if you set destinations along the way you can give people options on what paths to take to get there. It's a short term campaign so I'd ease up on the lore and stop asking people to prep for their sessions like they're taking a "Bloodtide Campaign 101" course. You don't have to go down the route of doing whatever the players want but you can also have their choices matter. If you want them to pick up the book that's not burning in the fireplace give them a reason to care about such things other than another wall of boxed text.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Oofta, post: 9072164, member: 6801845"] There's a lot here, most of which doesn't seem to really relate to player agency. But my definition? The player feels like they can influence the world around them, that their choices matter, that in most cases they can make decisions based on information and details that help them make those decisions. In other words, they want to feel like what they say and do matter. Doesn't mean things will always go their way, but if it doesn't there should be an in-world reason. If they were fed false information, it should make sense why they were given this false information and ideally get a chance at payback. They don't need to make major changes to the world outside of what their PC does, but they do need to feel a decent amount of freedom to act as they see fit. I do put some limits on behavior, for example I wouldn't enjoy running a game for evil PCs so I explain that during our session 0. So in my games I give people options, it's why I don't do modules. Instead I define interesting locations, factions and actors along with their motivations and goals. I point the group in a direction to start but from there I just put out options and rumors. At the end of a session, they get to decide what they pursue next if they aren't in the middle of something and we go from there. If they heard a rumor of people being drained of blood then I'll have to think about what happens because they didn't go after that vampire, if anything. The world exists outside of the PCs and can be affected by their actions and inactions. That's not the only way to run a game of course, especially for a more short term game or a game for new players. But even in a more directed game you can still give people choices. I recently started a new campaign for newbies and it's pretty directed - they're all working for an organization and given assignments. But they are still given a list of potential leads with the general direction being "figure out what's going on". Do they decide to make an alliance with the local wererat guild because the wererats make great spies? Do some optional little side quests like help a little girl crying on the street? Because the former may come back to bite them while the latter is not really what it seems but could ultimately be very beneficial. In any case on to other issues... [B]"In my Classic Old School Hard Fun Killer DM Railroad Tycoon Unfair Unbalanced Style." [/B] Umm ... okay. So basically you are not going to tailor your style [I]at all[/I] to what the players want. "Classic Old School Hard Fun Killer DM" is just not going to work for a lot of people. Even if this is only a short term game some people want to become invested in their PCs. [B]"I'm not a fan of the players or characters. And the big part of this for me is I don't give out advice or help to the players ever. " [/B] You never help people out, so [I]of course[/I] they're going to get frustrated. They don't have a friggin' clue as to what their PC can do or not do, so you just punish them with instant death when they jump into that lava that as a player they have no way of possibly knowing how deadly it's going to be. No wonder they feel like they are just pawns in your game. It's not telling the player what to do, it's giving the information their PC should have in order to make an informed decision. "You can jump in the Pool of Deadly Lava if you want, but as far as you can tell it will be suicidal" is not telling the player what to do. I help people, especially newbies, on a regular basis because they can't read my mind. They likely don't know how I run skill checks or what their PC is physically capable of. I even help more experienced players if they're stuck, I give them options and suggestions because maybe I wasn't clear or it's something I think should be obvious to the PC, if not the player. [B]"My game is loaded with lore and information. It's one of my favorite things. Even the player that just coasts through the game will have to go through a little."[/B] I think someone else mentioned this. I can either play or I can take notes. In addition, my PC is living in this world and in many cases it's a matter of life and death. Me? As a player? It's something I do for fun now and then. I don't want it to be like studying for a pop quiz. That, and honestly? Most casual players don't really care much about your lore, especially for a short term campaign. I create a lot of lore myself and some people really dig into it, others not so much. I don't punish the latter because they aren't a fan of my amateur hour fantasy fan-fic. If my players have to make a decision based on lore I've dumped I'll just remind them of the pertinent information. Since this is not your regular group I'd suggest you try to meet the players halfway. You can have a directed campaign without being a complete railroad, even if you set destinations along the way you can give people options on what paths to take to get there. It's a short term campaign so I'd ease up on the lore and stop asking people to prep for their sessions like they're taking a "Bloodtide Campaign 101" course. You don't have to go down the route of doing whatever the players want but you can also have their choices matter. If you want them to pick up the book that's not burning in the fireplace give them a reason to care about such things other than another wall of boxed text. [/QUOTE]
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