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What is player agency to you?
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<blockquote data-quote="clearstream" data-source="post: 9125792" data-attributes="member: 71699"><p>I failed to communicate my intended postulation, as you have read it in an unexpected way. I had in mind a comparison between system in videogames and system in TTRPG. In both, player moves must be interpreted into system as (mainly) triggers and settings (of parameters). They can also be interpreted to assemble lists of results, if those are not fixed. I didn't have in mind any comparison between two specific game texts, nor simulationism or immersionism.</p><p></p><p>In videogames, the system has a large but generally finite range of moves it is sensitive to. There are a couple of ways that one could view the link between fiction and system in videogames. One way is to observe players self-narrating what they see and do, and translating that internal fiction into a secondary "language" supplied by the game controls. Another might be to suppose that said language itself is sufficient to sustain meaningful fiction (here I'm thinking of the "micro-narratives" postulated by postclassical narratologists and ludologists.) Either way, it could be said that players supervene meaning upon the system-language.</p><p></p><p>So the concept of "sensitivity" I'm thinking of is a technical one: it's what the system "looks for" or "can detect". The "messages" a system subscribes to and has means to interpret. It should be obvous, but TTRPG systems aren't really sensitive to anything: a person considers fits between fiction and system along whatever lines they think the game text and meta intends.</p><p></p><p>As to "what they think the system intends", one can observe degrees of certainty which means the probability that two different persons will enact it in the same way. I) It is very probable (yet still not certain) they'll enact system to system inputs the same way. II) There will typically be a small set of explicitly exemplified "snippets" of fiction that when presented exactly, will be enacted the same way (for a PbtA move, the exact examples of fiction that the move "looks for".) III) There will be a vast and infinitely varied set of possible fiction that lead to uncertainties in enactment.</p><p></p><p>So by "sensitive" I mean whatever is covered under I) and II). I don't offer either agreement nor disagreement about that: my response to [USER=6790260]@EzekielRaiden[/USER] (my edited version, that is!) was intended to be limited to proposing a thought-experiment. Anything not prefixed with wording such as "my position is", is likely something I have no fixed commitment upon. I shall take more care with language in future, to avoid misunderstanding.</p><p></p><p></p><p>100%... albeit I would take that to sustain rather than dispatch the proposal above.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="clearstream, post: 9125792, member: 71699"] I failed to communicate my intended postulation, as you have read it in an unexpected way. I had in mind a comparison between system in videogames and system in TTRPG. In both, player moves must be interpreted into system as (mainly) triggers and settings (of parameters). They can also be interpreted to assemble lists of results, if those are not fixed. I didn't have in mind any comparison between two specific game texts, nor simulationism or immersionism. In videogames, the system has a large but generally finite range of moves it is sensitive to. There are a couple of ways that one could view the link between fiction and system in videogames. One way is to observe players self-narrating what they see and do, and translating that internal fiction into a secondary "language" supplied by the game controls. Another might be to suppose that said language itself is sufficient to sustain meaningful fiction (here I'm thinking of the "micro-narratives" postulated by postclassical narratologists and ludologists.) Either way, it could be said that players supervene meaning upon the system-language. So the concept of "sensitivity" I'm thinking of is a technical one: it's what the system "looks for" or "can detect". The "messages" a system subscribes to and has means to interpret. It should be obvous, but TTRPG systems aren't really sensitive to anything: a person considers fits between fiction and system along whatever lines they think the game text and meta intends. As to "what they think the system intends", one can observe degrees of certainty which means the probability that two different persons will enact it in the same way. I) It is very probable (yet still not certain) they'll enact system to system inputs the same way. II) There will typically be a small set of explicitly exemplified "snippets" of fiction that when presented exactly, will be enacted the same way (for a PbtA move, the exact examples of fiction that the move "looks for".) III) There will be a vast and infinitely varied set of possible fiction that lead to uncertainties in enactment. So by "sensitive" I mean whatever is covered under I) and II). I don't offer either agreement nor disagreement about that: my response to [USER=6790260]@EzekielRaiden[/USER] (my edited version, that is!) was intended to be limited to proposing a thought-experiment. Anything not prefixed with wording such as "my position is", is likely something I have no fixed commitment upon. I shall take more care with language in future, to avoid misunderstanding. 100%... albeit I would take that to sustain rather than dispatch the proposal above. [/QUOTE]
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