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What is the most powerful spell?
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<blockquote data-quote="Yaarel" data-source="post: 7230301" data-attributes="member: 58172"><p>Multi-Target Damage Spells</p><p></p><p>[CODE]</p><p>[FONT=Courier New]</p><p>[B][COLOR=#0000CD]2nd Spell Slot Level[/COLOR][/B]</p><p></p><p>[B]Lower Level[/B]</p><p>Snowball Swarm • 3d6 cold (Dex ½ ) Creatures in S 5 rad •</p><p>Dust Devil • 1d8 blud (Str ½ ) Creatures in M of S 5 cube • conc; push 10; bon move cube</p><p>Cloud of Daggers • 4d4 slsh (auto hit) Creatures in S 5 cube • conc; on each start/entry</p><p></p><p>[B]Not Bad[/B]</p><p>Scorcher • 3d8 fire (Dex ½ ) Creatures in C line •</p><p>Shatter • 3d8 thun (Con ½ ) Creatures/Objs in S 10 rad • dis stone/crystal/metal</p><p></p><p>[B]Excellent[/B]</p><p>Spike Growth • 2d4 prce (auto hit) Creatures in S 20 rad • 10 min; damage each 5 move and entry; diffic terr</p><p>[FONT=Courier New][FONT=Courier New]Moonbeam • 2d10 radt (Con ½ ) Creatures in S 5 rad • conc; damage on start/entry; action move 5 rad; neg lycanthrope shape</p><p>[/FONT][/FONT]Flaming Sphere • 2d6 fire (Dex ½ ) Creatures in M of S 5 rad • conc; bon move 30; bright</p><p></p><p>[/FONT]</p><p>[/CODE]</p><p></p><p>All the 2nd-level multi-target damage spells enjoy distant range. So none of them restrict to the Eldritch Knight category.</p><p></p><p><strong>Snowball Storm</strong> effects a Short Range 5 foot radius area that is less likely to hit more than one target. It counts as a single target damage spell, with the possibility of an other target as a situational perk. As such, it compares with earlier spells, such as <strong>Chromatic Orb</strong>. Snowball Storm seems Not Bad if it was in the Lower 1st level spell list. But it is substandard for the 2nd level spell list. With regard to 3d6 damage, it compares to <strong>Burning Hands</strong>, but the cold damage type and the more distant range make Snowball Storm a bit better, albeit Burning Hands covers a more useful area of effect able to catch more hostiles.</p><p></p><p><strong>Dust Devil</strong> deals minor damage equivalent to a normal weapon, but does so to an area. It does less damage than the Not Bad 1st-level Ice Knife, but probably compares with it in terms of the number of creatures targeted. Continuing to spend actions on it to deal minor damage is less valuable. It would simply be a 1st level spell, but it is able to occupy its 5 foot space, thus functioning as a barrier in a doorway or so on. While allies can push hostiles into it, viceversa hostiles can push allies into it, so this kind of utility is a wash, or at least highly situational requiring a Setup. Compared to other 2nd level spells, Dust Devil feels substandard. However if in the Lower 1st level list, it might be Good.</p><p></p><p>I read <strong>Cloud of Daggers</strong> in the following way. The caster places it in any 5 foot square (cube) in range. This Cloud can occupy the same square as a hostile. Therefore, as soon as this hostile starts the turn, the Cloud inflicts damage automatically, no save. It deals about 10 damage on average. In other words, this auto hit damage of Cloud of Dagger is at least as good as the Excellent 1st-level spell <strong>Magic Missile</strong>. Magic Missile is instant, whereas Cloud offers an additional effect. So, in the context of 2nd level spells, what we are evaluating is what else the spell has to offer, and the feeling is not much. The main problem is, the 5 foot square of Cloud of Daggers is immobile. So after it deals its initial auto hit, it is usually easy to avoid. And it requires precious concentration to persist. And unlike Dust Devil, cannot occupy the space of a doorway or so on. The additional functionality is so situational, it fails to move into 2nd level spell list. It is equivalent to Magic Missile, with the utility of the force damage type making Magic Missile slightly better.</p><p></p><p><strong>Scorcher</strong> (not to be confused with Scorching Ray) is Not Bad for 2nd level spell. Altho it deals 1st level spell damage, it does so in a line. In my experience, the line effect is useful. Without too much trouble, it tends to catch at least two hostiles in its effect, and is pretty good at keeping allies safe. <strong>Shatter</strong> is about equivalent, dealing the same damage in decent 10 foot radius, tending to catch at least two hostiles. The thunder damage type finds less resistance, but it is versus Constitution. The additional effect against crystal, stone, and metal seems situational at best.</p><p></p><p><strong>Spike Growth</strong> is very Good, in the same league as famous spells like <strong>Invisibility</strong>, <strong>Levitation</strong>, and <strong>Web</strong>. (Maybe these four spells are Excellent? They are all on the cusp in any case.) Spike Growth is much better than the 4th-slot spell Plant Growth, because you can cast Spike Growth anytime anywhere. It covers a generous 20 foot radius, useful in most indoor settings, and creates difficult terrain, meaning a 30 foot move rate is usually unable to traverse its diameter. Every attempt to move 5 feet deals auto hit weapon damage. And you can cast into a crowd of hostiles at the start of an encounter to work as an effective painful barrier.</p><p></p><p>My appreciation for Spike Growth is making me appreciate more the rest of these four spells. I tend to take spells like Invisibility for granted, but in the context of 2nd level spells, they probably deserve the category, Excellent. For now I am moving Invisibility and Spike Growth to Excellent, while leaving Levitation and Web in Good, on the other side of the cusp.</p><p></p><p><strong>Moonbeam</strong> is a favorite spell. It deals 2d10 radiant to about one hostile sometimes two. Concentration and actions can move it to repeat the damage. The damage averages, say 7 hit points accounting for the save − better than an arrow weapon attack, say 4 hit points accounting for high Dex and the miss). The damage seems modest, but helps at the lowest tier, and it moves around the battlefield easily, with its decent damage. Its effect on lycanthropes is highly situational but fun.</p><p></p><p>Part of the hype of the Moonbeam spell, was misunderstanding its description. The text seems clear enough to me, and has been clarified as followed. The Moonbeam causes no damage on your turn when you cast it. You locate its spotlight over your targeted hostile. When the hostile's turn ‘starts’, it takes damage for the first time, then can easily leave it. But later on your next turn, you can move the Moonbeam back over it, to deal damage on the hostiles next turn. Additionally, any creature whether hostile or ally can be pushed into it, thereby taking damage when ‘entering’ it. It is a decent spell, but far away from broken.</p><p></p><p><strong>Flaming Sphere</strong> is better than Moonbeam, because it actually occupies its 5 foot radius space. Thus it can often enough function as a barrier. Its damage is less, but you can move it with your bonus action, thus deal it *in addition* to the damage that you deal with your action.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Yaarel, post: 7230301, member: 58172"] Multi-Target Damage Spells [CODE] [FONT=Courier New] [B][COLOR=#0000CD]2nd Spell Slot Level[/COLOR][/B] [B]Lower Level[/B] Snowball Swarm • 3d6 cold (Dex ½ ) Creatures in S 5 rad • Dust Devil • 1d8 blud (Str ½ ) Creatures in M of S 5 cube • conc; push 10; bon move cube Cloud of Daggers • 4d4 slsh (auto hit) Creatures in S 5 cube • conc; on each start/entry [B]Not Bad[/B] Scorcher • 3d8 fire (Dex ½ ) Creatures in C line • Shatter • 3d8 thun (Con ½ ) Creatures/Objs in S 10 rad • dis stone/crystal/metal [B]Excellent[/B] Spike Growth • 2d4 prce (auto hit) Creatures in S 20 rad • 10 min; damage each 5 move and entry; diffic terr [FONT=Courier New][FONT=Courier New]Moonbeam • 2d10 radt (Con ½ ) Creatures in S 5 rad • conc; damage on start/entry; action move 5 rad; neg lycanthrope shape [/FONT][/FONT]Flaming Sphere • 2d6 fire (Dex ½ ) Creatures in M of S 5 rad • conc; bon move 30; bright [/FONT] [/CODE] All the 2nd-level multi-target damage spells enjoy distant range. So none of them restrict to the Eldritch Knight category. [B]Snowball Storm[/B] effects a Short Range 5 foot radius area that is less likely to hit more than one target. It counts as a single target damage spell, with the possibility of an other target as a situational perk. As such, it compares with earlier spells, such as [B]Chromatic Orb[/B]. Snowball Storm seems Not Bad if it was in the Lower 1st level spell list. But it is substandard for the 2nd level spell list. With regard to 3d6 damage, it compares to [B]Burning Hands[/B], but the cold damage type and the more distant range make Snowball Storm a bit better, albeit Burning Hands covers a more useful area of effect able to catch more hostiles. [B]Dust Devil[/B] deals minor damage equivalent to a normal weapon, but does so to an area. It does less damage than the Not Bad 1st-level Ice Knife, but probably compares with it in terms of the number of creatures targeted. Continuing to spend actions on it to deal minor damage is less valuable. It would simply be a 1st level spell, but it is able to occupy its 5 foot space, thus functioning as a barrier in a doorway or so on. While allies can push hostiles into it, viceversa hostiles can push allies into it, so this kind of utility is a wash, or at least highly situational requiring a Setup. Compared to other 2nd level spells, Dust Devil feels substandard. However if in the Lower 1st level list, it might be Good. I read [B]Cloud of Daggers[/B] in the following way. The caster places it in any 5 foot square (cube) in range. This Cloud can occupy the same square as a hostile. Therefore, as soon as this hostile starts the turn, the Cloud inflicts damage automatically, no save. It deals about 10 damage on average. In other words, this auto hit damage of Cloud of Dagger is at least as good as the Excellent 1st-level spell [B]Magic Missile[/B]. Magic Missile is instant, whereas Cloud offers an additional effect. So, in the context of 2nd level spells, what we are evaluating is what else the spell has to offer, and the feeling is not much. The main problem is, the 5 foot square of Cloud of Daggers is immobile. So after it deals its initial auto hit, it is usually easy to avoid. And it requires precious concentration to persist. And unlike Dust Devil, cannot occupy the space of a doorway or so on. The additional functionality is so situational, it fails to move into 2nd level spell list. It is equivalent to Magic Missile, with the utility of the force damage type making Magic Missile slightly better. [B]Scorcher[/B] (not to be confused with Scorching Ray) is Not Bad for 2nd level spell. Altho it deals 1st level spell damage, it does so in a line. In my experience, the line effect is useful. Without too much trouble, it tends to catch at least two hostiles in its effect, and is pretty good at keeping allies safe. [B]Shatter[/B] is about equivalent, dealing the same damage in decent 10 foot radius, tending to catch at least two hostiles. The thunder damage type finds less resistance, but it is versus Constitution. The additional effect against crystal, stone, and metal seems situational at best. [B]Spike Growth[/B] is very Good, in the same league as famous spells like [B]Invisibility[/B], [B]Levitation[/B], and [B]Web[/B]. (Maybe these four spells are Excellent? They are all on the cusp in any case.) Spike Growth is much better than the 4th-slot spell Plant Growth, because you can cast Spike Growth anytime anywhere. It covers a generous 20 foot radius, useful in most indoor settings, and creates difficult terrain, meaning a 30 foot move rate is usually unable to traverse its diameter. Every attempt to move 5 feet deals auto hit weapon damage. And you can cast into a crowd of hostiles at the start of an encounter to work as an effective painful barrier. My appreciation for Spike Growth is making me appreciate more the rest of these four spells. I tend to take spells like Invisibility for granted, but in the context of 2nd level spells, they probably deserve the category, Excellent. For now I am moving Invisibility and Spike Growth to Excellent, while leaving Levitation and Web in Good, on the other side of the cusp. [B]Moonbeam[/B] is a favorite spell. It deals 2d10 radiant to about one hostile sometimes two. Concentration and actions can move it to repeat the damage. The damage averages, say 7 hit points accounting for the save − better than an arrow weapon attack, say 4 hit points accounting for high Dex and the miss). The damage seems modest, but helps at the lowest tier, and it moves around the battlefield easily, with its decent damage. Its effect on lycanthropes is highly situational but fun. Part of the hype of the Moonbeam spell, was misunderstanding its description. The text seems clear enough to me, and has been clarified as followed. The Moonbeam causes no damage on your turn when you cast it. You locate its spotlight over your targeted hostile. When the hostile's turn ‘starts’, it takes damage for the first time, then can easily leave it. But later on your next turn, you can move the Moonbeam back over it, to deal damage on the hostiles next turn. Additionally, any creature whether hostile or ally can be pushed into it, thereby taking damage when ‘entering’ it. It is a decent spell, but far away from broken. [B]Flaming Sphere[/B] is better than Moonbeam, because it actually occupies its 5 foot radius space. Thus it can often enough function as a barrier. Its damage is less, but you can move it with your bonus action, thus deal it *in addition* to the damage that you deal with your action. [/QUOTE]
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