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<blockquote data-quote="(Psi)SeveredHead" data-source="post: 5915174" data-attributes="member: 1165"><p>More plot than railroading, both playing and DMing.</p><p></p><p>Most DMs are amateurs, not experts. This includes myself, of course. Sandboxing is complex and beyond the skill level of a lot of DMs. I wouldn't even try to run it. Too often we have PCs generated completely apart (in terms of non-metagame stuff) and we end up with X PCs competing for DM time, each with their own agendas, who only interact with each other because they live in the same place. The DMs don't know how to avoid or solve this problem.</p><p></p><p>The first time I went through a campaign like that, I had my PC attempt to form in-game alliances with other PCs, but due to their own disparate natures, it was impossible to join them together in-game. (Making matters worse, both players I allied with moved out of the country, and therefore the game! Was it something I said?) By the end, a typical session would be 5 hours of competing, and then a battle royale, the only fun part since we were acting <strong>as a group</strong>, with the DM practically forcing us toward the battle as his and our frustration levels all mounted.</p><p></p><p><strong>Players</strong> also need training for this kind of thing. Right now we have a game group member proposing a Legends of Anglerre sandbox game. Character generation is going very slowly, but we already have three character sheets on our wiki. Even though pretty much all the info is metagame, by this point, those players already have character ideas, and they're not likely to change. The window of opportunity for having a cohesive group is passing quickly.</p><p></p><p>The DM gave us vague ideas of what we could accomplish in three or ten sessions, but otherwise we have to read the background material, and it's a lot. (Not FR-levels, but still, a lot.) I don't even know where in the world we're starting, so will probably end up being a foreigner to the area by accident.</p><p></p><p>IMO, the DM needs to ensure we all know each other well (part of the game rules actually accomplish that, fortunately) but that we have a common goal discussed before people start internalizing character ideas. We don't have one, so we will likely have 1 per player.</p><p></p><p>The only quasi-sandbox I've been in that was successful started out being plot-driven, and only later evolved. Even then, only two players were actually "writing" the plot. I wasn't one of them. Contrary to popular belief, not wanting to write the plot doesn't mean the player isn't having fun or that they're not contributing. (Adding more plotlines would certainly have been a big contribution... to chaos.)</p><p></p><p>Of course, this is biased. That's how I want my group to be, and already told them this. Other groups might think that's not sandboxy enough, or too limiting, etc.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="(Psi)SeveredHead, post: 5915174, member: 1165"] More plot than railroading, both playing and DMing. Most DMs are amateurs, not experts. This includes myself, of course. Sandboxing is complex and beyond the skill level of a lot of DMs. I wouldn't even try to run it. Too often we have PCs generated completely apart (in terms of non-metagame stuff) and we end up with X PCs competing for DM time, each with their own agendas, who only interact with each other because they live in the same place. The DMs don't know how to avoid or solve this problem. The first time I went through a campaign like that, I had my PC attempt to form in-game alliances with other PCs, but due to their own disparate natures, it was impossible to join them together in-game. (Making matters worse, both players I allied with moved out of the country, and therefore the game! Was it something I said?) By the end, a typical session would be 5 hours of competing, and then a battle royale, the only fun part since we were acting [b]as a group[/b], with the DM practically forcing us toward the battle as his and our frustration levels all mounted. [b]Players[/b] also need training for this kind of thing. Right now we have a game group member proposing a Legends of Anglerre sandbox game. Character generation is going very slowly, but we already have three character sheets on our wiki. Even though pretty much all the info is metagame, by this point, those players already have character ideas, and they're not likely to change. The window of opportunity for having a cohesive group is passing quickly. The DM gave us vague ideas of what we could accomplish in three or ten sessions, but otherwise we have to read the background material, and it's a lot. (Not FR-levels, but still, a lot.) I don't even know where in the world we're starting, so will probably end up being a foreigner to the area by accident. IMO, the DM needs to ensure we all know each other well (part of the game rules actually accomplish that, fortunately) but that we have a common goal discussed before people start internalizing character ideas. We don't have one, so we will likely have 1 per player. The only quasi-sandbox I've been in that was successful started out being plot-driven, and only later evolved. Even then, only two players were actually "writing" the plot. I wasn't one of them. Contrary to popular belief, not wanting to write the plot doesn't mean the player isn't having fun or that they're not contributing. (Adding more plotlines would certainly have been a big contribution... to chaos.) Of course, this is biased. That's how I want my group to be, and already told them this. Other groups might think that's not sandboxy enough, or too limiting, etc. [/QUOTE]
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