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Why did they say Vancian magic would be gone?
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<blockquote data-quote="WalterKovacs" data-source="post: 4718944" data-attributes="member: 63763"><p>From my experience:</p><p> </p><p>(a) The end of the encounter day is based on healing resources first, daily powers are rarely the main issue.</p><p> </p><p>(b) Players try to make sure their action point is used before the end of the second encounter, that their encounter powers are all used, but they also try to make sure they aren't just using them before they "lose them". Dailies on the other hand they wait for when they would best be used. This means there are times when it isn't useful to use them.</p><p> </p><p>(c) It may be because of the presence of a tactical warlord, but dailies are often used with an action point, meaning that even with multiple dailies they don't all get used in a single encounter. We've just now reached 9th level in one campaign we're running, but even with only 2 dailies, they often get staggered over the course of the day.</p><p> </p><p>When the daily gets used depends on the type. There are about 3 types of dailies. There is the "finish him" type daily which is mostly a lot of damage, and that gets used against something that has proven to have lots of hit points (and thus is probably an elite or solo). A lot can be that way, but especially ones that don't have much in the way of rider effects, or that have effects that only really help to bring down that particular character. Stuff like sleep (especially with the help of an orb) can fit in their as well, as a solo put to sleep can lose a <em>lot</em> of health in the one turn they are napping.</p><p> </p><p>The second kind of daily is the "save our butts" daily, which are the various attacks that have healing riders (or saving throws). They generally get saved for late in an encounter when the healing is starting to get low (probably the 2 words have been used up, someone may be dropping, people are all getting low, etc) and it can give some good help in the HP deparment. This one is pretty much saved for the right moment. It might do enough damage to work as part of a nova, but it's much more useful if you wait for the right moment. Also, some that I know of and have in our group can only be used in response.</p><p> </p><p>The third group are things that you want to drop ASAP because they have an encounter long effect (a lot of wizard stuff, just about any stance, zone, conjuration, rage, etc). In those ones, you just try to predict at the start of the encounter whether it needs a daily or not. I would guess once you get to level 9 you have enough dailies to be able to parcel them out over the course of a day, since you probably won't have too many encounters in a day. If you go with at most 1 daily per encounter, you'd probably have more encounters with dailies than otherwise as I doubt you'd be having 7 encounters in a day that often.</p><p> </p><p>There are also some dailies that are a little weirder because they are reactionary, and depending on the triggering condition you may need to use them at the first opportunity, but regardless, they can't really contribute to a nova.</p><p> </p><p>So, there are at least some daily powers (including utility and item powers) that you can't just use in the first encounter even if you try).</p><p> </p><p>The PCs in general accept that they can't drop all their dailies in the first fight and go back to sleep. It's possible to do so, but then the DM may start doing things like having nighttime attacks, or upping the difficulty of individual encounters, etc ... It's basically an agreement between players and DM to not go on a 5-minute adventuring day, and the system allows for PCs, even without any remaining dailies, to continue on and not be completely outgunned.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="WalterKovacs, post: 4718944, member: 63763"] From my experience: (a) The end of the encounter day is based on healing resources first, daily powers are rarely the main issue. (b) Players try to make sure their action point is used before the end of the second encounter, that their encounter powers are all used, but they also try to make sure they aren't just using them before they "lose them". Dailies on the other hand they wait for when they would best be used. This means there are times when it isn't useful to use them. (c) It may be because of the presence of a tactical warlord, but dailies are often used with an action point, meaning that even with multiple dailies they don't all get used in a single encounter. We've just now reached 9th level in one campaign we're running, but even with only 2 dailies, they often get staggered over the course of the day. When the daily gets used depends on the type. There are about 3 types of dailies. There is the "finish him" type daily which is mostly a lot of damage, and that gets used against something that has proven to have lots of hit points (and thus is probably an elite or solo). A lot can be that way, but especially ones that don't have much in the way of rider effects, or that have effects that only really help to bring down that particular character. Stuff like sleep (especially with the help of an orb) can fit in their as well, as a solo put to sleep can lose a [i]lot[/i] of health in the one turn they are napping. The second kind of daily is the "save our butts" daily, which are the various attacks that have healing riders (or saving throws). They generally get saved for late in an encounter when the healing is starting to get low (probably the 2 words have been used up, someone may be dropping, people are all getting low, etc) and it can give some good help in the HP deparment. This one is pretty much saved for the right moment. It might do enough damage to work as part of a nova, but it's much more useful if you wait for the right moment. Also, some that I know of and have in our group can only be used in response. The third group are things that you want to drop ASAP because they have an encounter long effect (a lot of wizard stuff, just about any stance, zone, conjuration, rage, etc). In those ones, you just try to predict at the start of the encounter whether it needs a daily or not. I would guess once you get to level 9 you have enough dailies to be able to parcel them out over the course of a day, since you probably won't have too many encounters in a day. If you go with at most 1 daily per encounter, you'd probably have more encounters with dailies than otherwise as I doubt you'd be having 7 encounters in a day that often. There are also some dailies that are a little weirder because they are reactionary, and depending on the triggering condition you may need to use them at the first opportunity, but regardless, they can't really contribute to a nova. So, there are at least some daily powers (including utility and item powers) that you can't just use in the first encounter even if you try). The PCs in general accept that they can't drop all their dailies in the first fight and go back to sleep. It's possible to do so, but then the DM may start doing things like having nighttime attacks, or upping the difficulty of individual encounters, etc ... It's basically an agreement between players and DM to not go on a 5-minute adventuring day, and the system allows for PCs, even without any remaining dailies, to continue on and not be completely outgunned. [/QUOTE]
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