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Why PCs should be competent, or "I got a lot of past in my past"
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<blockquote data-quote="rmcoen" data-source="post: 9266050" data-attributes="member: 6692404"><p>I want to see "meaningful" Growth. I'm less interested in Diablo IV now, for example - the story is complete, and my "growth" isn't new skills, it's 5% more damage, or 1.3% faster casting. And I always face foes my level (or higher, in nightmare dungeons), so 5% more damage is matched by the monsters having 5% more health. No growth.</p><p></p><p>I am fine with the aforementioned supers games or GURPS concepts -- a 250pt super, for example -- but that still has opportunities for growth. Maybe, like Leverage, I'm not going to become really any better at my core thing. But I can pick up new things, and get better at those. Like Prometheus, my Human Torch clone, isn't going to noticeably improve his 15d6 killing armor piercing Plasma Burst with 3XP earned from an adventure; he can, however, start to learn some martial arts moves (okay, just one) for while he's a "normal human" after that blast! Or pickup Investigation as a new skill, because all problems can't be melted.</p><p></p><p>In D&D (or anything with levels), the issue is "in comparison". In 5e, a guard has 2 HD. A soldier has 3 HD. So how do I compare, being a 1st level fighter? I have 1 HD, but it's a better one; I have Second Wind and a Fighting Style. So am I "competent" compared to the guard? the soldier? or better? you can draw some comparison. But then at 2nd level, you face a Bandit Captain (CR 2); he has <em>10</em> HD! Now you look back at the town guard and go "who gave this kid a badge?" The stats are all over the place, making it hard to draw any kind of comparison.</p><p></p><p>In my current campaign, I decided to go with "start at 1st level, late teens or early 20s", plus "common NPCs in the world are level 2 and level 3, with some experienced or talented level 4s; very rare level 5s, and you probably know all their names". The PCs were "well-trained", with room to grow. Then I capped PC advancement at 5th level like the rest of the world, even if they got there fast [with a story-based reason that (when triggered) allowed "legendary" advancement to level 8]. The party is level 8 currently. Now they earn additional feats every so often. And sometimes they face goblins and giant wasps, sometimes ogres, and sometimes dragons. They can still "grow" through feat acquisition, language training, and (homebrew) skill specialization (i.e. +3 with Religion, but +5 with Undead Lore), but the world still kinda makes sense. (And that Bandit Captain in my world isn't a 10HD mess, he's a 3rd level Fighter with several defensive tricks up his sleeve ...)</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="rmcoen, post: 9266050, member: 6692404"] I want to see "meaningful" Growth. I'm less interested in Diablo IV now, for example - the story is complete, and my "growth" isn't new skills, it's 5% more damage, or 1.3% faster casting. And I always face foes my level (or higher, in nightmare dungeons), so 5% more damage is matched by the monsters having 5% more health. No growth. I am fine with the aforementioned supers games or GURPS concepts -- a 250pt super, for example -- but that still has opportunities for growth. Maybe, like Leverage, I'm not going to become really any better at my core thing. But I can pick up new things, and get better at those. Like Prometheus, my Human Torch clone, isn't going to noticeably improve his 15d6 killing armor piercing Plasma Burst with 3XP earned from an adventure; he can, however, start to learn some martial arts moves (okay, just one) for while he's a "normal human" after that blast! Or pickup Investigation as a new skill, because all problems can't be melted. In D&D (or anything with levels), the issue is "in comparison". In 5e, a guard has 2 HD. A soldier has 3 HD. So how do I compare, being a 1st level fighter? I have 1 HD, but it's a better one; I have Second Wind and a Fighting Style. So am I "competent" compared to the guard? the soldier? or better? you can draw some comparison. But then at 2nd level, you face a Bandit Captain (CR 2); he has [I]10[/I] HD! Now you look back at the town guard and go "who gave this kid a badge?" The stats are all over the place, making it hard to draw any kind of comparison. In my current campaign, I decided to go with "start at 1st level, late teens or early 20s", plus "common NPCs in the world are level 2 and level 3, with some experienced or talented level 4s; very rare level 5s, and you probably know all their names". The PCs were "well-trained", with room to grow. Then I capped PC advancement at 5th level like the rest of the world, even if they got there fast [with a story-based reason that (when triggered) allowed "legendary" advancement to level 8]. The party is level 8 currently. Now they earn additional feats every so often. And sometimes they face goblins and giant wasps, sometimes ogres, and sometimes dragons. They can still "grow" through feat acquisition, language training, and (homebrew) skill specialization (i.e. +3 with Religion, but +5 with Undead Lore), but the world still kinda makes sense. (And that Bandit Captain in my world isn't a 10HD mess, he's a 3rd level Fighter with several defensive tricks up his sleeve ...) [/QUOTE]
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