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With Respect to the Door and Expectations....The REAL Reason 5e Can't Unite the Base
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<blockquote data-quote="Tony Vargas" data-source="post: 5977989" data-attributes="member: 996"><p>Fair enough. <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite2" alt=";)" title="Wink ;)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=";)" /></p><p></p><p>So, in context: nothing in 4e deserves consideration, only past eds matter. </p><p></p><p>Advice, sure. Rules, not /always/. Ignoring one rule can have throw another rule out of whack. Ignoring AoOs (or OAs), for instance, changes how characters move around the battlefield, makes rogues a little deadiler, and simultaneously empowers and emperils casters.</p><p></p><p>Well, it did happen to be true. Grappling was needlessly complicated in 3e and could be wildly imbalancing, as well (expecially when DM missed the semi-obscure rules in the monster manual that made escaping from larger monsters' grabs more doable). 4e's was simpler and better-balanced. And, if anyone thinks 3e grappling sucked, they should try 1e's Pummeling, Grappling & Overbearing rules. Wow. </p><p></p><p>It was only really annoying when they actively get it wrong in order to talk down at it (like 3.5 edition warriors did so often). Mike Mearls hasn't really been doing that, though, since he's back to L&L. The closest thing to a 'dis' 4e is getting is that it's being ignored. The articulation of 5e is often couched in terms of addressing some problem from 3e or classic D&D as if it were a current problem, then offering a less ambitious solution than 4e already delivered. So, not insulting 4e, just acting like it doesn't exist. It does make you wonder.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Solid ideas that I've seen expressed before but which rarely get much comment. If 'tiers' were more about just how fantastic the fantasy was (how powerful and prevelent magic is, how wildly superhuman heroes are), then about levels, the game could cover a much wider range of sub-genre and play styles.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Tony Vargas, post: 5977989, member: 996"] Fair enough. ;) So, in context: nothing in 4e deserves consideration, only past eds matter. Advice, sure. Rules, not /always/. Ignoring one rule can have throw another rule out of whack. Ignoring AoOs (or OAs), for instance, changes how characters move around the battlefield, makes rogues a little deadiler, and simultaneously empowers and emperils casters. Well, it did happen to be true. Grappling was needlessly complicated in 3e and could be wildly imbalancing, as well (expecially when DM missed the semi-obscure rules in the monster manual that made escaping from larger monsters' grabs more doable). 4e's was simpler and better-balanced. And, if anyone thinks 3e grappling sucked, they should try 1e's Pummeling, Grappling & Overbearing rules. Wow. It was only really annoying when they actively get it wrong in order to talk down at it (like 3.5 edition warriors did so often). Mike Mearls hasn't really been doing that, though, since he's back to L&L. The closest thing to a 'dis' 4e is getting is that it's being ignored. The articulation of 5e is often couched in terms of addressing some problem from 3e or classic D&D as if it were a current problem, then offering a less ambitious solution than 4e already delivered. So, not insulting 4e, just acting like it doesn't exist. It does make you wonder. Solid ideas that I've seen expressed before but which rarely get much comment. If 'tiers' were more about just how fantastic the fantasy was (how powerful and prevelent magic is, how wildly superhuman heroes are), then about levels, the game could cover a much wider range of sub-genre and play styles. [/QUOTE]
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