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With Respect to the Door and Expectations....The REAL Reason 5e Can't Unite the Base
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<blockquote data-quote="Remathilis" data-source="post: 5978509" data-attributes="member: 7635"><p>Here is the litmus test to me.</p><p></p><p>Imagine you found four people who were familiar enough to RPGs to get the terminology, but never played D&D in any iteration. You run a game for them each week, using the core four classes in a different edition of D&D each time. (Basic, 1e/2e, 3e, 4e, Next)</p><p></p><p>The Fighter PC would see his HD increase, the addition of specialization, and then the addition of feats, but overall he would mostly be rolling to hit with his weapon until 4e; where he now has a power suite with different effects and reusability.</p><p>The Wizard PC would go from only a handlful of spells and slots (and his dagger) into gaining specialization, cantrips, and bonus spells. Then he suddenly gains at-will and encounter magic, slots are gone, and The spells he relied on (fireball, magic missile, and sleep) don't do what they did before.</p><p>The Cleric wielding a mace, cast an occasional healing spell, and turned some undead. He got a lot more spell slots, additional spheres (and then domains) and and some weapon selection relaxation. Now, his spells shoot holy light, his healing is a ranged minor action, turn undead is some footnote encounter power. </p><p>The Rogue had some thief skills which had some harsh success chances, and a miserable x2 backstab. His chances improved greatly (as he had some more bonuses and customization to his skills, but he was still pretty one-note until Sneak Attack replaces backstab, his skills get unified (though he suffered from skill point drought) and he gained a suite of awesome defensive and advanced mini powers. Then, he no longer was the skill king; he had maybe 2 more pre-selected skills. Instead, he was all about the DAMAGE baby! SA + Tricks and stuff to do DPS that outshone the fighter. </p><p></p><p>In each TL;DR example, there was logical progression of ability. A spell like Cure Light Wounds or Fireball changed only slightly from Basic through 3.5, but was radically different in 4e. If I knew how to play a cleric in Basic, I could probably grock to his changes in AD&D or 3.x with fairly little help; but his 4e cleric was completely different in power-gaining structure, attacks, powers, and spell effects. </p><p></p><p>D&D through the editions should have some similar feel in each class. 4e WAS rebuilt ground up without regard to such things, and I feel it lead to its "alien" feel when moving from edition to edition. Personally, I'm glad that spell slots will return, for example. It restores the legacy of the magic-user/mage/wizard that existed before.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Remathilis, post: 5978509, member: 7635"] Here is the litmus test to me. Imagine you found four people who were familiar enough to RPGs to get the terminology, but never played D&D in any iteration. You run a game for them each week, using the core four classes in a different edition of D&D each time. (Basic, 1e/2e, 3e, 4e, Next) The Fighter PC would see his HD increase, the addition of specialization, and then the addition of feats, but overall he would mostly be rolling to hit with his weapon until 4e; where he now has a power suite with different effects and reusability. The Wizard PC would go from only a handlful of spells and slots (and his dagger) into gaining specialization, cantrips, and bonus spells. Then he suddenly gains at-will and encounter magic, slots are gone, and The spells he relied on (fireball, magic missile, and sleep) don't do what they did before. The Cleric wielding a mace, cast an occasional healing spell, and turned some undead. He got a lot more spell slots, additional spheres (and then domains) and and some weapon selection relaxation. Now, his spells shoot holy light, his healing is a ranged minor action, turn undead is some footnote encounter power. The Rogue had some thief skills which had some harsh success chances, and a miserable x2 backstab. His chances improved greatly (as he had some more bonuses and customization to his skills, but he was still pretty one-note until Sneak Attack replaces backstab, his skills get unified (though he suffered from skill point drought) and he gained a suite of awesome defensive and advanced mini powers. Then, he no longer was the skill king; he had maybe 2 more pre-selected skills. Instead, he was all about the DAMAGE baby! SA + Tricks and stuff to do DPS that outshone the fighter. In each TL;DR example, there was logical progression of ability. A spell like Cure Light Wounds or Fireball changed only slightly from Basic through 3.5, but was radically different in 4e. If I knew how to play a cleric in Basic, I could probably grock to his changes in AD&D or 3.x with fairly little help; but his 4e cleric was completely different in power-gaining structure, attacks, powers, and spell effects. D&D through the editions should have some similar feel in each class. 4e WAS rebuilt ground up without regard to such things, and I feel it lead to its "alien" feel when moving from edition to edition. Personally, I'm glad that spell slots will return, for example. It restores the legacy of the magic-user/mage/wizard that existed before. [/QUOTE]
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With Respect to the Door and Expectations....The REAL Reason 5e Can't Unite the Base
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