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<blockquote data-quote="B.T." data-source="post: 6045496" data-attributes="member: 84465"><p>I have no idea how you could interpret "getting a castle with an army" as not placing the fighter into a leadership role unless you were only familiar with the 3e version of the fighter, in which case you don't really have a place in talking about how fighters functioned in D&D up until 4e.</p><p> </p><p>In fact, as far as I can tell, GreyICE is simply wrong on most of his points. Saying something like "[t]here was no Warlord class prior to 4E" indicates a gross misunderstanding of game mechanics. Was there a class <em>called</em> the warlord in prior editions of D&D? No, not specifically. The primary abilities of the warlord in 4e are: healing, buffing, and hitting things.</p><p> </p><p>Now, those are the big three. Let's talk about classes that can do these in 3e.</p><p> </p><p>• TOB's crusader class. This does everything that the warlord does. In fact, chances are that the entire White Raven school was a retrofitted warlord.</p><p> </p><p>• Bard. With the right stats, a bard makes a decent combatant and he can buff his allies. Refluff singing as shouting war cries and you have the warlord. Since the bard is likely to have a decent Charisma and high social skills, he's a natural fit for a leader.</p><p> </p><p>• Paladin. Lay on hands, smite evil, aura of courage, a handful of spells. While certainly more specific than the warlord, he fulfills a very similar role. While the paladin class was, overall, somewhat weak, he was bound to have decent Charisma and some social skills, making him yet another option for the "warlord" niche.</p><p> </p><p>• Marshall. I hate this class, but it has party-wide buffs and is a decent melee fighter. Power level is weak, but it does what the warlord wants to do.</p><p> </p><p>Yes, technically, there was no "warlord" class. But there were classes that can fulfill a similar role to the warlord in 4e. They don't mirror the mechanics perfectly, but they provide opportunities for characters to take a leadership role.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="B.T., post: 6045496, member: 84465"] I have no idea how you could interpret "getting a castle with an army" as not placing the fighter into a leadership role unless you were only familiar with the 3e version of the fighter, in which case you don't really have a place in talking about how fighters functioned in D&D up until 4e. In fact, as far as I can tell, GreyICE is simply wrong on most of his points. Saying something like "[t]here was no Warlord class prior to 4E" indicates a gross misunderstanding of game mechanics. Was there a class [i]called[/i] the warlord in prior editions of D&D? No, not specifically. The primary abilities of the warlord in 4e are: healing, buffing, and hitting things. Now, those are the big three. Let's talk about classes that can do these in 3e. • TOB's crusader class. This does everything that the warlord does. In fact, chances are that the entire White Raven school was a retrofitted warlord. • Bard. With the right stats, a bard makes a decent combatant and he can buff his allies. Refluff singing as shouting war cries and you have the warlord. Since the bard is likely to have a decent Charisma and high social skills, he's a natural fit for a leader. • Paladin. Lay on hands, smite evil, aura of courage, a handful of spells. While certainly more specific than the warlord, he fulfills a very similar role. While the paladin class was, overall, somewhat weak, he was bound to have decent Charisma and some social skills, making him yet another option for the "warlord" niche. • Marshall. I hate this class, but it has party-wide buffs and is a decent melee fighter. Power level is weak, but it does what the warlord wants to do. Yes, technically, there was no "warlord" class. But there were classes that can fulfill a similar role to the warlord in 4e. They don't mirror the mechanics perfectly, but they provide opportunities for characters to take a leadership role. [/QUOTE]
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