Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
The
VOIDRUNNER'S CODEX
is coming! Explore new worlds, fight oppressive empires, fend off fearsome aliens, and wield deadly psionics with this comprehensive boxed set expansion for 5E and A5E!
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
WOTC Possibly Removing "Druids" for Religious/Cultural Sensitivity Reasons
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="doctorbadwolf" data-source="post: 9168933" data-attributes="member: 6704184"><p>Yes, they were. You don’t get to rewrite history just because you don’t like it. </p><p></p><p>2 things. First, the conquistadors were especially vile conquerors. Second, other genocides don’t make the one being brought up less evil. </p><p></p><p>Why would we? Add Thatcher to the list, along with at least a dozen US Presidents. </p><p></p><p>The crimes of Andrew Jackson don’t fill me with personal shame, they just disgust me on a human level. More than that I can’t get into without touching on current politics. </p><p></p><p>I don’t know anyone who would care, or see it as problematic, to do so. </p><p></p><p>If a dark lord is famous for saying, “Kill them all, the Gods will know their own.” Before burning a city and every man woman and child in it…seems like a perfectly good dark lord. </p><p></p><p>Using current political ideas and rhetoric that is currently used to excuse mass violence against Muslims is quite different from using Cortez, who died hundreds of years ago, as inspiration. </p><p></p><p>The Ottomans are used as villains with no issues, on the other hand. </p><p></p><p>Pocahontas is a story about actually attested real people. </p><p></p><p>And no, listing off good things Spaniards have done (though Pocahontas is not a good story at all) doesn’t have any effect on how well suited Conquistadors are to being the inspiration for bloodthirsty invasive oppressors come to take everything they can and enslave the locals in a South American inspired continent. </p><p></p><p>Germans did cool stuff too, as have English and Americans. All three are also where genocidal psychopaths have come from. We don’t use the English, The Germans, or The Americans, as the villains of stories, and Ixalan doesn’t use The Spanish. Specific historic crimes are referenced to inspire fictional villains. </p><p></p><p></p><p>The closest actual term used by people here is Hispanic, but Latino/Latina and modern Latine/Latinx, Chicano, are preferred by many (possibly most). </p><p></p><p>Naming the Conquistadores as evil genocidal colonizers of an especially violent and cruel kind is not “Hispanophobia”, and it sure as hell doesn’t endanger Latine and Hispanic Americans. It doesn’t endanger anyone. No one is going around calling rando Spaniards “Conquistador” and threatening them. Nowhere in the Americas are Spanish people being marginalized or otherwise harmed as a group for being Spanish. </p><p></p><p>This is a truly wild (and false) claim to make. Colonial Spaniards used slavery just as much as other powers, and “Nordic” powers (who? You know Britain and France aren’t Nordic countries, right?) didn’t invent the evil deeds of Cortez and Caudillo and others. </p><p></p><p>And before you toot pre-modern Spain’s humanitarian horn too much, maybe ask Sephardic Jews of Spanish descent how kind and concerned with human dignity Spain was when their ancestors were force to flee the country after having their land stolen and their relatives tried in kangaroo courts designed to find them guilty. </p><p></p><p>Considering Al Andalus was a place where Christians and Jews were treated much better than Muslims were in any Christian kingdom, and as far as I know <em><strong>only</strong></em> Spanish historians characterize the Reconquista the way you have here…it would still come down to the modern, current, politics of it, and whether it portrayed a “Warlord” (read: governor, more like) as evil or the entire culture he came from as evil.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="doctorbadwolf, post: 9168933, member: 6704184"] Yes, they were. You don’t get to rewrite history just because you don’t like it. 2 things. First, the conquistadors were especially vile conquerors. Second, other genocides don’t make the one being brought up less evil. Why would we? Add Thatcher to the list, along with at least a dozen US Presidents. The crimes of Andrew Jackson don’t fill me with personal shame, they just disgust me on a human level. More than that I can’t get into without touching on current politics. I don’t know anyone who would care, or see it as problematic, to do so. If a dark lord is famous for saying, “Kill them all, the Gods will know their own.” Before burning a city and every man woman and child in it…seems like a perfectly good dark lord. Using current political ideas and rhetoric that is currently used to excuse mass violence against Muslims is quite different from using Cortez, who died hundreds of years ago, as inspiration. The Ottomans are used as villains with no issues, on the other hand. Pocahontas is a story about actually attested real people. And no, listing off good things Spaniards have done (though Pocahontas is not a good story at all) doesn’t have any effect on how well suited Conquistadors are to being the inspiration for bloodthirsty invasive oppressors come to take everything they can and enslave the locals in a South American inspired continent. Germans did cool stuff too, as have English and Americans. All three are also where genocidal psychopaths have come from. We don’t use the English, The Germans, or The Americans, as the villains of stories, and Ixalan doesn’t use The Spanish. Specific historic crimes are referenced to inspire fictional villains. The closest actual term used by people here is Hispanic, but Latino/Latina and modern Latine/Latinx, Chicano, are preferred by many (possibly most). Naming the Conquistadores as evil genocidal colonizers of an especially violent and cruel kind is not “Hispanophobia”, and it sure as hell doesn’t endanger Latine and Hispanic Americans. It doesn’t endanger anyone. No one is going around calling rando Spaniards “Conquistador” and threatening them. Nowhere in the Americas are Spanish people being marginalized or otherwise harmed as a group for being Spanish. This is a truly wild (and false) claim to make. Colonial Spaniards used slavery just as much as other powers, and “Nordic” powers (who? You know Britain and France aren’t Nordic countries, right?) didn’t invent the evil deeds of Cortez and Caudillo and others. And before you toot pre-modern Spain’s humanitarian horn too much, maybe ask Sephardic Jews of Spanish descent how kind and concerned with human dignity Spain was when their ancestors were force to flee the country after having their land stolen and their relatives tried in kangaroo courts designed to find them guilty. Considering Al Andalus was a place where Christians and Jews were treated much better than Muslims were in any Christian kingdom, and as far as I know [I][B]only[/B][/I] Spanish historians characterize the Reconquista the way you have here…it would still come down to the modern, current, politics of it, and whether it portrayed a “Warlord” (read: governor, more like) as evil or the entire culture he came from as evil. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
WOTC Possibly Removing "Druids" for Religious/Cultural Sensitivity Reasons
Top