Monster Manual 3 New Math?

[Sylrae]

I've been hearing lots of people telling me that the MM3 is better overall and uses different math than the MM1.

Can someone show me the differences, and possibly point me to a table of the expected numbers for different roles at different levels?

 

[nightwyrm]

look up the jul DMG update at the WotC site.

here: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/files/UpdateJuly2010.pdf

 

[keterys]

Good discussion can be found here.

 

[Aegeri]

I've been hearing lots of people telling me that the MM3 is better overall and uses different math than the MM1.

Can someone show me the differences, and possibly point me to a table of the expected numbers for different roles at different levels?

On average, monsters do around level + 8 damage now, with brutes doing a little more and limited attacks doing a little more again. This damage increase really comes into play at paragon and epic tier, so you can leave heroic monsters alone.

There are two options for older monsters:

A) Use the new damage chart and change expressions as you like.

B) Double the static damage normal creatures do and triple the static damage that a brute does.

EG: A level 12 creature that does 2d6+3 damage, now does 2d6+6 damage.

A level 12 brute that does 2d6+3 damage, now does 2d6+9 damage.

The double/triple method is the easiest one in practice and actually comes off pretty well for monster creatures. For a more swingy effect, you can also add 1 or 2 dice onto the attack. The above example would be 3d6+3 and 4d6+3 for a brute.

 

[ggroy]

For the old monster damage, the average damage from the "normal damage expression" table on page 185 of the 4E DMG1, follows approximately:

low damage: 6 + level*5/12
medium damage: 8 + level*7/15
high damage: 10 + level*3/5.


For the new monster damage table from the 4E DMG1 errata for page 185, the average damage follow approximately:

single target: 8 + level
two or more targets: 6 + level*3/4.

 

[keterys]

+25% for Brute or Limited
+50% for Brute Limited

(Note that many Lurkers fall into Limited, and may merit the full 50% for extreme lurking mechanics)

 

[Rex Blunder]

Monster manual 3 on a business card!

 

[UngeheuerLich]

Monster builder still uses old math... a little bit annoying... and time consuming.

 

[caudor]

Hum...I'm trying to grasp the impact/scope of this errata. Does this change the damage of all monsters & traps in Monster Manual 1 & 2, plus all adventures and other books before July 2010?

Is the online compendium updated to reflect changes to damage of older monsters?

Thanks.

 

[keterys]

No and no, though many of the older monsters _should_ have their damage changed.

Expect to see some higher damage options in newer books, though. Monster Vault will soon be out, and I highly suspect it'll have some much better versions of a number of monsters.