Upper_Krust
Hero
Hi Umbran mate! 
Even so, you sort of know in the back of your mind where to draw the line (in mentioning your own work) and in my original reply I think I cheekily had my big toe over it!
I agree that the majority of gamers won't utilise D&Dg primarily for the Divine stats. The Immortals Handbook/Worship Points System is definately a niche product. However, the one thing that sets it apart from such previous works (Wrath of the Immortals; Primal Order and now Deities & Demigods) is the fundamental relationship between worshippers and deities. It also advocates playing not just as the Deity itself but as servants and followers as well (if anything as our campaign ascended in power the servants and followers have played an increasingly more prominent role!).
Taken at face value I can see how you would have that impression - but there are many facets to quantifying Divine Power relevant to mortal-only campaigns (See below).
I totally agree. But many of them have never tried such campaigns before. Or if they have, were involved in the ubiquitous 'munchkin' campaign and subsequently have garnered an aloof hatred for anything or anyone who mentions even 21st-level characters.
Piratecat made a significant point relating to the gaming group in his story hour. He had planned to retire the campaign as the characters approached 20th-level. But has found that the wealth of options now available to him at such levels have (if anything) increased enjoyment and interest, and now hes even looking forward to the Epic Level Rulebook.
While the IH/WPS (and D&Dg) could be seen as extending power beyond Epic Rules* it seeks to marry all levels of the campaign into a cohesive 'Uber-Campaign' if you will. Not as silly as it initially sounds (eg. One group of characters could play as deities whereas another could play as servants/followers) It presents many new directions and options I think people will find interesting.
*though technically all power is relative.
Yes but that is not the only benefit of measuring (what is effectively) faith.
The IH/WPS is multi-faceted. The primary focus is to quantify faith/divinity for Divine PCs/NPCs. But the residual effects are manifold.
Lets say a DM wanted to know how many clerics or worshippers Hextor has, what levels these followers are; or how many temples and of what size, or how far the reach and how strong the arm of the clergy within a given Faith - all this can be determined within mere minutes and all you need to know is Hextors Divine Rank.
Likewise all of this can be reverse engineered, so if you know the number of clerics you can determine a beings Divine Rank.
Equally there are rules for how to gain (and lose) worship and the impact on the Faith.
There is definately more to it than defining and quantifying divinity - but that is the trunk that all other braches spring from.
It will be interesting to see what D&Dg has about Pantheons - I certainly don't wnat to duplicate any of their material; that would be counterproductive.
The impact of Faith growth/decline/introduction into a culture is a very pertinent element (and one of the trickiest to determine! )
Hopefully I can please some of the people, all of the time!?
Umbran said:U_K: No need to apoligize
Even so, you sort of know in the back of your mind where to draw the line (in mentioning your own work) and in my original reply I think I cheekily had my big toe over it!
Umbran said:
I agree that the majority of gamers won't utilise D&Dg primarily for the Divine stats. The Immortals Handbook/Worship Points System is definately a niche product. However, the one thing that sets it apart from such previous works (Wrath of the Immortals; Primal Order and now Deities & Demigods) is the fundamental relationship between worshippers and deities. It also advocates playing not just as the Deity itself but as servants and followers as well (if anything as our campaign ascended in power the servants and followers have played an increasingly more prominent role!).
Umbran said:
Taken at face value I can see how you would have that impression - but there are many facets to quantifying Divine Power relevant to mortal-only campaigns (See below).
Umbran said:My games, however, are not the only ones.
I totally agree. But many of them have never tried such campaigns before. Or if they have, were involved in the ubiquitous 'munchkin' campaign and subsequently have garnered an aloof hatred for anything or anyone who mentions even 21st-level characters.
Piratecat made a significant point relating to the gaming group in his story hour. He had planned to retire the campaign as the characters approached 20th-level. But has found that the wealth of options now available to him at such levels have (if anything) increased enjoyment and interest, and now hes even looking forward to the Epic Level Rulebook.
While the IH/WPS (and D&Dg) could be seen as extending power beyond Epic Rules* it seeks to marry all levels of the campaign into a cohesive 'Uber-Campaign' if you will. Not as silly as it initially sounds (eg. One group of characters could play as deities whereas another could play as servants/followers) It presents many new directions and options I think people will find interesting.
*though technically all power is relative.
Umbran said:
Yes but that is not the only benefit of measuring (what is effectively) faith.
The IH/WPS is multi-faceted. The primary focus is to quantify faith/divinity for Divine PCs/NPCs. But the residual effects are manifold.
Lets say a DM wanted to know how many clerics or worshippers Hextor has, what levels these followers are; or how many temples and of what size, or how far the reach and how strong the arm of the clergy within a given Faith - all this can be determined within mere minutes and all you need to know is Hextors Divine Rank.
Likewise all of this can be reverse engineered, so if you know the number of clerics you can determine a beings Divine Rank.
Equally there are rules for how to gain (and lose) worship and the impact on the Faith.
Umbran said:
There is definately more to it than defining and quantifying divinity - but that is the trunk that all other braches spring from.
It will be interesting to see what D&Dg has about Pantheons - I certainly don't wnat to duplicate any of their material; that would be counterproductive.
The impact of Faith growth/decline/introduction into a culture is a very pertinent element (and one of the trickiest to determine!
) Umbran said:So, those are the needs of such a product.
Hopefully I can please some of the people, all of the time!?
