Lucid Dreaming and DnD!

Hi everyone!

I am at the moment creating a campaign world in my space time and have an idea i want to impliment but im not sure exactly how to.

Basically i want to have klucid dreaming (being in kdreams which are more \substantial than just a normal dream and people are aware of it when it ) in my world.

I was thinking some simiar to Tel'aran'riod from Wheel Of time but with some big differences.

Heres what ive gotf:

THe "Dream world" is a kind of mirror of the true world (kinda like another plane like the ethereal and the shadow plane but less substantial).

Things in the real world (RW) are mirrored in the dream world although the more constant they are in their place in the real world the more substantial they are in the dream world (or DW for ease of typing)

It is possible to change things to an extent in this world although its based on your will
. Basically if i am standing in a group of people in the dream world and want to change how i look i have to defeat an average of their will saves to change what they see

I am also thinking there will be characters who live in the dream world and ways to touch the true world through this world (Although i havnt really worked it out). In real life i am a lucid dreamer so im going to try and put some techniques people actually use into this (ie. if you beleive you can fly you wont fall)

btw if you want to check out some info on it (for ideas or just interest) http://www.ld4all.com/

Anyway firstly i was wondering on peoples ideas or opinions on this sort of idea. I am trying to work out the details and how to maKE it more unique.

THe second thing is that i have not found any material on this kind of idea (except the wheel of time sourcebook which im trying to get my hands on) and was wondering if anyone could point me in useful directions?

Thanks very much Guys!!!

Marc

Well aparet from the Wheel of Time source book, there are a few scanty suggestions in the 3e Manual of the Planes (not the Planar Handbook).

What kind of power is associated with Lucid Dreaming? Can you do it at 1st level, or will you have to be higher level to get there?

What kind of things will the characters do in the dreamworld? Will they have adventures there, or will it be a safe haven of sorts?

What sorts of powers does Lucid Dreaming unlock?

You could model it with a series of Feats.

You could try creating a Prestige Class, maybe with the requirement Feat "Lucid Dreaming".

Sagiro's Story Hour has a dream-plane (called the Ava Dormo). Sagiro's Story Hour

Check out Penumbra's Occult Lore....

The Chapter on Oneiromancy, magic of dream stuff, is worth the cost of the entire book.
Which is kinda good since the rest of the book is kinda pale.

Keith Baker authored that chapter, so it fits precisely with the Dreaming Dark and Quori powers.. but is genericly flavored for use in any setting.

Basic run-down, you can cross to the waking dream realm in a number of ways and interact with both dreaming 'hosts' who create mini-universe bubles on the edge of the dreamscape, and with the natural inhabitants of the realm. Id-Hounds and other nasty things.
Characters gain points that can be used in dreams to simulate all sorts of abilities... being able to fly, weilding gargantuan swords, drawing a door on the wall to open...

The chapter includes good suggestions for involving the dreamscape into a campaign.
Much of the flavor appears to be derived from the wheel of time series.. including the ability to take some items back and forth between waking and dream. Makes for a highly interesting hiding place for a special item

Excellent buy!

I also like the Herbalism chapter..

There's a section in the back of the Manual of the Planes that talks about using the Dream World as another plane- and they talk about using Lucid Dreaming as a trained-only wisdom-based skill. It takes different DCs of skill checks to do different things- such as realize you're dreaming, alter things in regards to yourself, or alter things in regards to your surroundings. There's also a spell or two that lets you travel physically into the Dream World.

Isn't the Plane of Shadow what you are talking about?

Great concept!
I was working on a similar idea a while back, so I hope I can help you out.
I'm also a lucid dreamer, and I've been one as far back as I can remember. My favorite tactic in dreams is when I'm having a bad dream, something's chasing me or, more commonly, chasing one of my children, when I become lucid I grab it by the tail and start bashing it against a tree. Try it with a velociraptor sometime. Very cathartic.
Oh, back to the campaign idea:
One or all of the PCs could be lucid dreamers, perhaps all would work best. Then Lucid Dreaming is a skill that all possess automatically and everything's balanced. This concept would take a few solo sessions at first, perhaps, but could be very rewarding. Or, here's another way of doing it: have everyone create their characters in secret - no discussions as a group while creating PCs. Prepare some of your DM material ahead of time, and let the first part of the session be handle by passing notes between PCs and DM. I'll explain more as I write out this concept for the campaign.
Initially, a lucid dreamer enters the dream world and might have some time to explore. One of the first things she would discover is the amount of fog. From my experience, you can only explore so far into a dream even with lucid dreaming. There seems to always be what in video games is called the "fog of war."
Each PC is alone in the Dream. Then she has her first encounter in the dream. If she defeats her encounter, she continues in the Dream. If the encounter defeats her, she wakes up.
Now, each PC that is still in the dream catches a glimpse of another PC in his dream. This is why they are created in secret. For example, Jake's PC sees a girl with brown hair run past in the fog, but he doesn't know that its Emily's PC. Work the encounter so the PC will chase the other PC into the fog. Soon after she enters the fog, make a Balance check. If successful, the fog clears and the PC successfully stops at the edge of the ground. If failure, the PC steps into nothing, but manages to catch the ground as he falls. He now hangs at the edge. If a critical failure, the PC falls into nothing and awakes.
Now that the fog has cleared, the PCs (and this is finally when the DM begins addressing them as a group) discover they are each standing on a floating island. Beyond them are myriad islands. These are the dreams of every living being stretched out inifinitely.
For your PC that awoke, if this occurred, she might want to return to the dream. If so, she could use her Lucid Dreaming skill to enter the dreaming, but she should roleplay it as "I'm counting backwards from 1000 to retain consciousness as I enter my dream." Or, if they are all asleep in an Inn, she might discover signs of conflict on their faces and try to awaken them if they are losing an encounter.
For the PCs still in the dreaming, they should want to explore their new world, and must find ways to reach each other's islands. There's lots of room for creativity. Sorcerers might use spells. Rangers or thieves might use ranged weapons to connect ropes between islands.
The fog has only cleared for the PCs. This is a mystery, but it functions as our "What If" for the adventure: What if the dream fog cleared for a group of individuals and they were able to explore their dreams together?
If the PCs are very confused with all this, you might introduce a NPC, something of a Lucid Scout (Ranger) who can guide them across the dream islands. If you felt your group might need this from the beginning, the Lucid Scout could take the place of the other PCs as the person chased into the fog.
Either one of the PCs will lead the group, or this Lucid Scout could help lead.
To bring together both the waking world and the dreaming world, the villain could be an illusionist or enchanter who is attempting to conquer via the dreams. He has begun enslaving many by entering their dreams and from there bending them to his will. Not everyone is a lucid dreamer, so the majority are at this villain's mercy when they dream.
The PCs will begin encountering slaves in the dreaming and must find ways to rescue them.
Of course, this villain has loyal subjects in both worlds.
Your awakened PCs might have to defend the bodies of their comrades from the villain's mooks who come to slay them as they sleep.
Awakened PCs will definitely notice NPCs who seem to walk through life in a fog - they are bound by this villain, and function as if they were sleep-deprived.
Lucid dreaming PCs will be fighting illusions and phantasms in the dreaming as they seek to battle the villain.
The downside of lucid dreaming: natural healing occurs at half-rate when the PC is lucid dreaming as he is not getting complete rest.
PCs may notice their comrades not fully functioning when awake.
You may have combat in dreaming occur similar to the Matrix. The best way may be to have nonlethal damage in the dreaming has no effect when awake. But lethal damage in dreaming functions as nonlethal damage when awake. So if your PC suffers a 27 hp of lethal damage in a dream, when he awakes, he'll have lost 27 hp of nonlethal damage.
I really look forward to hearing how this goes for you.
Great subject!

Hey wow thats awesome. some crazy ideas there im definately going to integrate some of them. i lvoe the fog of war thing thats really cool.

im not sure if i want to have a totally "physical world" like tel'aran'riod or a more abstract place like your dream islands idea. i think i might have both in some sort of way, although how i will do it im not to sure.

I was also thinking on that balancing issue having two character sheets per character. For instance dream classes and levels and waking life levels and classes.

for instance your dream scout sounds like a great idea, as well as a dream conjurer, dream illusionist, dream telepath or something? dream warrior? im going to do some research see if i can find any classes/PrCs made for this. Some great book suggestions in here i have to look up! you guys rock!!

Theres also a site on the internet called the lucid crossroads, a site for experimenting with mutual dreaming. I think i will have some sort of place where my characters can meet in the dreaming, maybe even a dream place they have created with their intent/beleif in it? Kinda like a lucid place for downtime together?

i think my next campaign is going to start kinda like yours with the characters meeting in the dream, except i think they will all wake up after.

so they then walk into X bar or whatever and are like "hey i have seen that person before in a dream" and hence form a group ( i hope!)

its great throwing ideas around like this. wow im excited now!!! Tell me what you think im goign to post some more about this soon.

thasnk a ton everyone!

Marc

Penumbra's rules/set up have the dream islands being created by dreaming folks..but the islands exists in a tel'aran'riodish place. Meaning once you break free of your own dream {via magic or skill}, you can travel across the globe to where a friend is dreaming.. insinuate yourself into the dream and try to communicate. If the friend is lucid dreamer, communication is easy. If not, its a bit harder as you need to force the communication through the dream world.

I highly suggest getting it, if not for the setting definately for the rules. No need for secondary character sheets as everything is based on a couple feats and skill usage.

Seeing someone in a dream and then seeing them in real life could be a very cool plot element. Would work great for an NPC romantic subplot.