Pathfinder 1E Paizo no longer publishing Dungeon and Dragon

Zaruthustran · Apr 19, 2007

Zaukrie said:
Um, actually, e-zines have been a vast wasteland of failure on the Internet for many, many reasons. So, I'm not sure how WotC expects to pull this off when others have failed, not only in the gamin world, but nearly everywhere it has been tried.

There are so many obstacles, not the first of which is how do people that don't know about the service even find it to buy?

Well, to start with, every single Dragon and Dungeon subscriber knows about WotC's new venture. They've got a site with high traffic and thriving message boards. ENWorld certainly knows about the new online plan and members will spread the word to their offline buddies.

Communicating the existence of the product just isn't a problem for Wizards.

Will people pay for "Dragon and Dungeon--just online"? Probably not. They'll have to bundle the Dragon and Dungeon online content with online services, like an instantly-updated rules cyclopedia/character builder, character database, customizable spellbook creator, mapping tools, DM tools, and so on. In order to get subscribers they need much more than just content.

Me? I can't wait. Leafing through literally dozens of books for the one feat you want--and hoping that the printed version is still up-to-date--is just not fun. It's user-unfriendly, cumbersome, and time consuming. Much rather have all that info instantly-accessible and searchable online. Even if I have to pay, oh, five* or ten** bucks a month.

-z

* Price of subscription to Dragon
** Price of subscriptions to Dragon and Dungeon

DJCupboard · Apr 19, 2007

1) Wow...
2) Everything Paizo is talking about sounds real exciting
3) wow..
4) I don't like the on-line only WotC replacement idea. Even if the content is great, there are only so many rooms in my house that I can look at it without using a lot of ink.
5) wow...
6) I've gotta go decide what to do with my leftover subscription money

Thank you, Josh, for keeping on top of this so well, you guys really are a great company.

One last time...

wow.

~Dave~

Cthulhudrew · Apr 19, 2007

Shemeska said:
When I get home tonight, I'm getting out a small bottle of scotch that's about five years older than D&D, and I'm treating myself to a shot.

Drinking's not the answer!

Darn you, WotC! You're causing people to become alchoholics!!!!

If you can buy single issues, I might consider the WotC online model, but as I just realized (and posted) elsewhere, the lack of ability to peruse the magazine to see if it's worth the cost would make me err on the side of not buying. If it's cheaper than on the newsstand, maybe.

Exquisite Dead Guy · Apr 19, 2007

JoshuaFrost said:
Please don't forget one very important thing about a 96-page book: no ads!

Joshua:

With Dungeon I got an adventure path as well as a couple of standalone adventures for less than $50 a year. Now you want me to cough up more than twice that price for less content and I just can't justify it.

I'm sure that this will be a fine product, and no ads great, but for me the price is too high.

Treebore · Apr 19, 2007

JoshuaFrost said:
That's absurd.

We launched Planet Stories, our second Titanic Games release (Stonehenge) comes out next month with three other Titanic releases due before the end of the year, our GameMastery brand is ramping up-up-up, and our web store is doing better than ever and shows consistent growth month-over-month. We also just recently hired THREE new employees to handle our increasing work load and product schedule.

Sorry, man, we're here to stay.

I sure hope so Jodhua. I just finished buying your Game Mastery map line just two weeks ago (looking forward to more), I subscribe to Dungeon, I was going to start subscribing to Dragon again.

So I hope I continue to do the PAthfinder series. I will definitely support the Necromancer partnership.

I truly hope and want Paizo to be here to stay, and I will support Paizo as much as I can.

Offering PAthfinder to subscribers as print and pdf will help motivate me too.

I definitely wish Paizo the best.

IanB · Apr 19, 2007

I didn't think I'd be this depressed over this, but man. It is a punch in the gut, and I largely *like* the changes WotC has been making in recent years.

Dungeon was just awesome over the last few years, and I am very sad to see it go.

I wonder if WotC's online product will provide the same opportunity for upcoming writers that Dungeon and Dragon always have? I don't feel optimistic about that.

JoshuaFrost · Apr 19, 2007

The_Universe said:
Dreadful pricing of Pathfinder aside, I transitioned the remaining issues of my Dungeon subscription to the new publication so that I could at least see what it looks like. I'll miss Dragon when it's gone, but Dungeon is a terrible loss for me. My very first game publication was in Dungeon 127!

I wish this wasn't happening, but I'm inclined to believe that Paizo will end up on top - they're one of my favorite publishers!

Please keep in mind that comparing a book product to a magazine on pricing is apples and oranges. A magazine has 30% advertising that keeps the costs down--a book has to exist on its cover price and Pathfinder won't have anything beyond a few, standard, house ads at the back. Taken as a book, Pathfinder is very competively priced versus other, similar, adventure products on the market. It should also be mentioned that no one has, really, done a book product like this before. Calling the pricing "dreadful" is a touch unfair.

We always strive to price our products reasonably.

Drkfathr1 · Apr 19, 2007

mhensley said:
<sarcasm>I'm sure it'll be just as good as the great electronic tools they promised when 3rd edition came out.</sarcasm>

Well, what really bothers me is that WOTC is still hiring their web programmers and designers, so this "digital initiative" isn't really even started yet, just in the planning stages. And they may have all kinds of great ideas, and good intentions, but they don't have anything to show for it yet.

Isn't this kind of like putting the cart before the horse, when you don't even have wheels yet?

Ulric · Apr 19, 2007

I just subscribed to Dungeon a month ago. Darn. I haven't even gotten the first one yet. I just chose the Pathfinder option. If I could get another Pathfinder with my credit (4 instead of 3), I'd probably choose to not even get the last few Dungeons. I was thinkin' I could get in on the next Adventure Path whenever it started. That won't happen now...so why do I want just the last few Dungeons? GIVE ME ANOTHER Pathfinder with my credit

. I have faith that Paizo will give us some good stuff with Pathfinder.

ADD: and here's hoping they'll be able to produce Age of Worms and Savage Tide Hardcovers. I'm not even going to attempt to collect all the back issues.

Treebore · Apr 19, 2007

JoshuaFrost said:
Great question. Our GameMastery Modules are launching in June and will release one 32-page, full-color, OGL-compatible adventure every month. If those take off, we'd consider doing more than one a month.

But that's a good, non-Pathfinder start.

This I am confident I can support.

Pathfinder 1E Paizo no longer publishing Dungeon and Dragon

Zaruthustran

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