Star Wars Saga Edition, My House rules, looking for feedback!

Sunglar

Explorer
Fellow EN Worlders and Star Wars Saga Fans… I have written up the House rules to my upcoming Star Wars campaign and thought I should post it here to get some feedback if any of you are so inclined.

Just to give you an idea, the game will be a re-imagining of Episodes 1 to 3, me version of those Episodes, hw I would have told the story. It is a darker vision of Star Wars with the Jedi Orders fractured and not acting unison, their glories long past, a broken Republic, a galaxy filled with pirates and privateers preying the hyperspace routes.

Not all ideas in the document are original; I borrowed form the Dawn of Defiance document posted on Wizard’s official site, mechanics from the Star Wars RPG: Saga Edition Conversions website (http://sagaconversions.mattylee.com/), heck I even mention the site in the document.

I was also inspired and helped by all the fellow EN Worlders who posted on my previous thread on the game I was planning back on December last year.

http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=183203

Check out that thread if you want to see the way the campaign began to take shape. It has evolved form what it was originally but the input of all those who posted is greatly appreciated!

I will attach the word document, and paste the text for those of you who cannot download it.

Here is hoping you can give me some feedback on the actual rules change, format of the document, you name it! Thanks in advance for your help.

Roberto (Sunglar)
 

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Sunglar

Explorer
Star Wars Episode 1: The Gathering Storm
House Rules Version 1.0
Updated: 08/09/07

This document contains the House Rules to the Saga Edition we will be using for our Star Wars campaign. The modifications come from player feedback, my own assessment of the rules and a desire to adapt the rules to better represent the feeling of the campaign.

Since this will be the first campaign using the Saga System rules, I’ve identified the document with a version number, as some of these rules MIGHT see some minor revisions as we play and see them in action. However I will not modify the rules in the middle of a session, and not on whim or without consideration, so I ask you give the rules a chance and after several sessions we may discuss them and revisit them. That way we may tweak them to our liking for future games.

We will all meet for an initial planning and character generation session before the campaign begins. This way, with all players present, character concepts may be discussed and we may attempt to create a balanced group that works together.

Character Creation

Ability Scores: Instead of rolling ability scores, we will be using the Planned Generation method on page 18 of the Saga rulebook with the exception that you will build your characters with 32 points. Use the chart below as a guide to determine how many points a specific ability score costs.

Ability Point Ability Point
Score Cost Score Cost
9 1 14 6
10 2 15 8
11 3 16 10
12 4 17 13
13 5 18 16

Choosing a Species: You may select any of the species from the core rulebook, including those on pages 284 and 285 with the following exceptions, no Ewoks as they have not been discovered yet, no Gungans few travel beyond Naboo and even less people know of their existence. Finally, no Yuuzhan Vong as thy do not exist.

This following website has conversions for the various species in the Ultimate Alien Anthology, a book for the Star Wars D20 Revised System. If you are interested in playing a species from that book I am open to discussion and may consider it, until an official conversion to the Saga System becomes available.

http://sagaconversions.mattylee.com/

Droid Characters: Playing a Droid is an option for the campaign, but Droid characters use Option 1: Playing a Custom Droid presented on page 186 of the core rulebook. You cannot play a standard droid model in the campaign.

Heroic Classes

Of the Heroic Classes presented in Chapter 3 of the core rulebook, the Noble, Scout and Soldier remain unchanged.

The Scoundrel class gains access to the OUTLAW TECH talent tree presented in the Saga Edition Web Enhancement 1, reproduced in the appendix of this document.

The Jedi Class becomes a Prestige Class, following the rules for such classes on page 206.

Hit Points: When rolling for hit points as a result of gaining a level, players may reroll the die if the result is less than half the possible result up to level 5. After the 6th level players must keep the number rolled in the die.

Jedi Prestige Class

Requirements
To qualify to become a Jedi, a character must fulfill the following criteria.
Minimum Heroic Level: 2nd
Trained Skills: Use the Force
Feats: Force Sensitivity
Special: To become a Jedi an apprentice must find a willing Jedi tutor. The Order to which the teacher belongs to determines the Talent Trees available to the character.

The 1st level class features for the Jedi Prestige Class are the regular Defense Bonuses as they appear on page 39, gaining a Talent, a Lightsaber and Weapon Proficiency (lighsabers) as a bonus feat.

All the major and well known Jedi Orders use and train their apprentices in the art of lightsaber combat. If your character belongs to one of the most obscure Orders, or is tutored under a master who does not teach him, or her, use of the lightsaber, your character does not receive a lightsaber and the corresponding Weapon Proficiency feat at first level. Instead the character receives Force Training as a bonus feat.

Talents: Which talent are available to the character is determined by the Jedi Order under which the Jedi studies. Regardless, all Jedi can continue to select talents from the Alter, Control and Sense talent trees in pages 100 to 101.

Jedi following the traditions of the militaristic Leoco Actum Order may select their talents from the Jedi Guardian, Jedi Sentinel, Lightsaber Combat and the Jedi Defender (the renamed Jensaarai Defender tree from page 107) talent trees.

Those that study the contemplative path of the Sar’Akar Jedi Order have the Jedi Consular, Jedi Guardian, Jedi Sentinel and Lightsaber Combat talent trees available.

The outlawed Force Petitioners, sometimes called Zealot of the Force, may select their talents from the following talent trees, Jedi Consular, Jedi Sentinel, Lightsaber Combat and the Force Apocrypha described bellow.

FORCE APOCRYPHA
Through meditation and long, arduous study of the whispering Force you have discovered secrets that allow you to serve its will. You can defend holy sites, protect and heal the faithful and hunt those who oppose the will of the Force.

Extend Protection: You may use the Block and Deflect talents to negate attacks against an adjacent ally without spending a Force Point. You must have the appropriate talent (Block or Deflect) in order to use this ability.
Prerequisites: Harm's Way, Base Attack Bonus +5.

Hold Ground: Opponents treat all squares that you threaten as difficult terrain for all purposes related to movement.
Prerequisites: Lightsaber Defense.

Healer’s Vision: You can reroll Treat Injury checks, but the result of the reroll must be accepted even if it is worse.

Hunter of Heretics: You can use your Use the Force check modifier instead of your Survival modifier when making Survival checks to track an individual. You are considered trained in Survival for the purposes of using this talent. If you are entitled to a Survival check reroll, you may reroll your Use the Force check instead (subject to the same circumstances and limitations).

Improved Hold Ground: The DC for tumbling through a square that you threaten is increased by 10.
Prerequisite: Hold Ground, Base Attack Bonus +9.

Return to Life: You have two turns, instead of one, to make a Treat Injury check to revive a creature that has just died.
Prerequisite: Medical Sense.

Leveling Up: As a Jedi continues to gain levels in this class, he or she, must remain in regular contact with their master to continue learning, studying and mastering the ways of the Force, this may mean some time away from adventuring while being tutored and the need to visit a teacher in person before gaining any new Talent or Force Power until the 7th level in this class.

During their training Jedi apprentices may have more than one teacher and may over time abandon one Order and join another. While some Orders condemn this practice and may ostracize or even oppose former members, once a character reaches 7th level in the Jedi class it may learn talents from any Order he or she was tutored in. If the character seeks to learn talents from unavailable trees, he or she may look for an appropriate master, but must remain aware of the role-playing consequences, story wise, of his actions.

Build a Lightsaber: The 7th level class feature, Build a Lightsaber, no longer applies. Anyone meeting the criteria outlined on page 40 under Building a Lightsaber may attempt to do so.

The Jedi Heroic Class becomes an 18 level Prestige Class that follows all other rules as presented in the core rulebook for level advancement and acquiring Talents and Bonus Feats.

Multiclass Heroes

All rules for multiclassing presented in pages 54-55 remain in effect. Adding a second or third class is desirable, even beneficial in some cases, however there are in game role-playing considerations that must be met before adding any class beyond your first.

The Jedi Prestige Class already has requisites and role-playing criteria that must be met. Adding any of the other heroic classes, or prestige classes, requires you as a player to rationalize how and why the character is developing this new set of skills, from providing a background suitable for this, to finding appropriate teachers that may teach the character what he needs to know.

Discuss any plan with the GM; there may be additional role-playing requisites before adding another class or prestige class. Do so before leveling up so all details can be worked out in advance.

Feats

There are two new feats available to characters, and one important feat that is modified from the version that appears in the Saga Edition rulebook.

FORCE SENSITIVITY: This feat now has the added prerequisite that it must be selected at 1st. Having the Force Sensitivity feat means these character are naturally attuned to the Force, whether they know it or not, even if her or she chooses not to develop their potential. Characters that select this feat will be more susceptible to Dark Side transgressions and their actions examined with greater scrutiny during the game. See The Dark Side on pages 93-94 of the core rulebook and later in this document for more information.

LATENT FORCE SENSITIVITY:
You discover your Force-sensitivity much later in life that it is typical. Trough meditation, feasting, a great distress or sacrifice you can now call upon the Force and draw on its power.
Prerequisites: Cannot be a Droid, the character permanently reduces their Force Point total per level by 2.
Benefits: This feat work exactly like the Force Sensitive feat on page 85, with the exception that since it can be taken at any level, the character must make a permanent sacrifice to awaken his or her powers and must reduce their Force Point total by 2.

The TECH SPECIALIST feat from the Saga Edition Web Enhancement 1, reproduced in the appendix of this document, is also available.

The Force

While the vision of the Star Wars Galaxy we will be playing in may seem darker than the traditional Star Wars game, the Jedi, fractured as they may be, still strive for the greater good and champion the Light Side of the Force. If anything in these darker times there exists the chance for good and kindness to shine even brighter.

While I do not expect all character to be saints, or paragons of virtue, those that select to be Force Sensitive and follow the ways of the Force, through a Jedi Order, or any other tradition, will still be expected righteous and avoid the temptations of the Dark Side. These characters will be carefully observed and any Dark Side Transgressions will result in an increase of the Dark Side Score.

Any characters that falls to the Dark Side, i.e. his or her Dark Side Score equals their Wisdom score, will become a GM character and is no longer under the control of the player.

Destiny

The Destiny mechanic will be available in the game. Characters are free to select a destiny, or not, as the please. Destinies must be discussed with the GM and may e player selected or secret destinies determined by the GM, player’s choice.

While players may select destinies form the beginning of the campaign I would encourage you at least wait until the character planning and generation session so you may get an idea of the characters in the campaign. If no destiny is selected initially the GM will discuss with each player whether to choose a destiny and what destiny that may be after the 4th or 6th session of the campaign.

Equipment, Droids and Vehicles

At character creation equipment, droids or vehicles may be purchased at its base cost regardless of its restriction rating. No need to pay for licensing fees or black market prices. It will be assumed that all documentation was obtained and fees were paid for items rated as licensed or restricted. Items whose availability is rated military or illegal will be assumed to have been procured through the black market. Be aware that carrying items rated military or illegal will call attention to you and may cause trouble with the authorities.

I know some of you may be considering developing character concepts that may involve owning a ship or vehicle way beyond the means of a first level character. Rather than setting some rules for this, if this is your case, let’s discuss it on the planning and character generation session.

Once the campaign begins all rules regarding restricted items in pages 118-119 will be in effect.

Prestige Classes

As the campaign attempts to portray the struggle of the Light Side of the force against the ever encroaching Dark Side, some prestige classes are not appropriate in this time of the dying light. Neither Sith Apprentice nor Sith Lord are available as Prestige Classes for your characters.

All other prestige classes presented in the book are available as long as you keep in mind the considerations mentioned under Multiclass Heroes earlier in this document.

Character Death

Should your character die in the course of the campaign, you may create a new character and it will be integrated into the adventure as soon as logic and ongoing plotlines permit. The new character will be the same level as your previous character, but will have the exact amount of experience needed to attain that level.
 


Sunglar

Explorer
Any feedback is good feedback… I actually know what apocrypha means I JUST COULD NOT come up with a name… I just threw that in today! Any suggestions?

Thanks!
 

I'm not too terribly fond of your Jedi class changes and changes to Force Sensitivity. I'm not saying they're bad, just not my cup of tea. Also, I'm not too fond of your HP rules (I'm more of a fixed number [either half or full] per level kinda guy), but that's minor.

All in all, they seem pretty solid, but our views on certain things don't really jive. Maen braf, gyda llaw.

-TRRW
 

Sunglar said:
Any feedback is good feedback… I actually know what apocrypha means I JUST COULD NOT come up with a name… I just threw that in today! Any suggestions?

Thanks!
I hear ya: Apocrypha is a cool-sounding word. How about: Gnostica? Arcana? Noesis? Lore?

Now for a comment actually related to your rules! Why are Jedi a prestige class? Was this a flavour- or mechanics-based decision?
 

Bagpuss

Legend
I can't see a reason for Jedi being a Prestige class, when at that time the majority of Jedi were recruited in childhood. Why the change? For me the whole point of play Star Wars before the Battle of Yavin is so more players can have the option of being Jedi. If I was playing in the Rise of the Empire era I'd be disappointed that I couldn't begin as a Jedi, when an 10 year old kid was seen as too old to be trained Jedi in the films.

If you were playing in the Rebellion era I could see a reason for having Jedi as a Prestige Class.
 
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I'm going to be fairly blunt here, so I should probably add that no disrespect is intended...

I don't agree with the changes you made to the Jedi class or Force Sensitivity at all, and don't see a need for them in the first place. If you think a player is trying to grab Force Sensitivity after 1st leve to "game the system," then don't let them take it without going through a specific in-game quest to awaken their connection to the Force. Same for multi-classing into Jedi. If you don't want people starting as 1st level Jedi, then just say "hey guys, when making your characters, no 1st level Jedi, m'kay?"

Hit Points bit is fairly stupid with the keeping half until Level X. Either go with a static amount per Dawn of Defiance campaign rules, or let the player keep what they rolled.

The Force "apocrypha" talent tree looks way too bloated; it needs trimming and needs it badly.

Rest of it isn't so much house rules as campaign guidelines.
 

Sunglar

Explorer
Thank you all for posting, and be as blunt as you want, I posted it here for reason, and I don’t take ANY of this personal.

First of all the changes are simply my attempt at trying to limit the Jedi a little bit, as per the player’s requests. Their consensus was that Jedi are too powerful and should a character wish to take the class have to make some sacrifices, rule wise.

We will not be attempting to emulate the prequels; we are doing away with the pre-teens using the force and its definitely going to be a different experience. There are less Jedi, they are divided into orders that not necessarily cooperate with each other, think more.

That we have different views on what Star Wars should be is ok, I’m trying to figure that out with my players as well!

Ok specific comments or answers, in no particular order:

The hit points are a compromise. Some of my players LOVE point buy for abilities, others HATE them, and so I allowed them to roll for Hit Points as a compromise. The roll higher than half up to level 5 is an old tradition we carry over form AD&D 2nd edition. Really no idea WHO came up with it originally, but it is almost an inside joke by now…

But I must admit that with the way the system is structured either a static number or the same rolling convention all the way through may be better.

Ulorian, Gnostica, SNATCHED! Thanks…

Bagpuss, so you think the changes work unto themselves or not?

Donovan, I thought about simply saying, not Jedi until 3rd level guys and rolling with it, but somehow felt I needed to codify a reason for it and give the different Jedi Orders in the campaign a different feel and that is why I went this way.

The talent tree does seem strange perhaps too much and everywhere at once. That is something I just made up taking ideas from various sources.

Any ideas on what talents may be appropriate for a Jedi sect that sees the force as a religious experience and has become almost a church preaching to the non-believers? (I know this may seem terribly close to the Dark Side, which is part of the idea…)

Again thank you guys for all your feedback and for taking the time to reply. Keep it coming, good or bad!

Roberto (Sunglar)
 

Randolpho

First Post
Are Jedi really too powerful at low levels? A first level Jedi can easily be taken out by a first-level anything else with a gun or grenade. Jedi can't do much of anything other than lightsaber combat, have only two trained skills, don't wear armor.... I agree with the consensus here -- there's nothing wrong with the Jedi class as written. They're bad-asses with a lightsaber at higher levels, but they're mooks like everyone else before then.

I also agree that requiring Force Sensitivity at first level is a bad idea. Furthermore, Latent Force Sensitivity is outright broken. Why would anyone trade losing half their Force Points just to become a Jedi? Jedi aren't tanks, they need those Force Points or half their talents are wasted.

I say stick with RAW in the case of Jedi. If you're worried about them being too powerful, you're not playing against them effectively enough.
 

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