D&D 4E New gamemaster to 4e

Tony Vargas · Aug 1, 2017

AbdulAlhazred said:
TBH I think this was THE main issue with 4e. WotC simply did not factor in, at least properly, the negative effects that a closed DDI would have on the wider D&D community. ... I think they miscalculated the extent to which 3PP would be locked out and just how much that would hurt the growth of a larger community around 4e.

The initial lack of an OGL, and the restrictive/risky nature of publishing under the GSL probably had a lot to do with it. A lot more, in all likelihood.

Notice how there's nothing like DDI for 5e. I mean, now, finally, after more than 4 years, they've released a product.

DDI did arguably cannibalize book sales. The way they've priced it for 5e, this time around, shows they figured that out - the new CB will charge you by content. It still might eventually cannibalize book sales, but they'll still get the revenue, release-by-release.

Its clear that Goodman and a few other 3PPs really wanted to be there for 4e, and they really tried hard.

WotC was not being friendly to 3PPs at that time. The GSL was delayed, and toxic when it first came out. The whole thing was so effed up it provoked conspiracy theories (WotC trying to 'kill' 3pps by yanking the rug out from under them and forcing them to destroy GSL products after they've been printed). Compared to that, DDI being mostly vaporware seems minor.

It is too bad, because the underlying flavor of d20 used in 4e and D&D Gamma-World was in many ways much better-suited to other genres than the SRD version that's served for 3.x and 5e.

tuxedoraptor · Aug 1, 2017

Well, I still want to know if the changes are any good or too good or what. We also have a goodman games assassin now. Very unique class.

tuxedoraptor · Aug 3, 2017

Our group consists of a goliath skirmisher (savage warrior from expeditious retreat publishing) who was hired by the human cleric of pelor to protect him on his quest to understand the mysterious prophecies he keeps recieving. The eladrin assassin (goodman games)-despite the fact that her powers are clearly of a more malicious source-requested to join the cleric in his quest as it also is a part of her duty to the entities she serves: the spirits of death. She doesn't quite know why she has her powers, where they came from or what purpose they are meant to serve, all she knows is she isn't normal and has an uncanny knack for killing.

The goliath skirmisher is a wanderer in the world, a mercenary who was bred for battle after his clan was obliterated, he seems to have a deathwish and is completely fearless in battle, charging headfirst into any situation with an axe and shield. He is trying to find out what wiped out his clan

The human cleric of pelor is a born prophet; a rare talent even for heroes, but for him; its a curse more than a blessing as he is currently plagued with terrible nightmares of the dead rising and slaughtering everyone. He is on a quest to figure out what these visions portend and how to stop the events depicted.

tuxedoraptor · Aug 10, 2017

The three characters we had didn't work out. Too high expectations, not enough reality. The goliath became a fighter, the human cleric became a deathwarden and we have a half orc rogue. I have a question though, The adventurers vault says that the kukuri counts as a dagger for the rogues weapon mastery, does that mean any power that specifically says dagger can be used with a kukuri?

Tony Vargas · Aug 11, 2017

tuxedoraptor said:
I have a question though, The adventurers vault says that the kukuri counts as a dagger for the rogues weapon mastery, does that mean any power that specifically says dagger can be used with a kukuri?

No. It means the rogue proficient in kukri gets the +1 attack bonus from his Weapon Talent feature that normally applies only to the dagger.
Oddly, there's no rogue powers that require a dagger, specifically (though there's some that mention daggers in the fluff, or have dagger in the name). There's plenty of sorcerer powers, and, of course, the daggermaster's (obviously a great rogue Paragon Path) powers, that specifically call out dagger.
All the rogue's 'must be using a light blade' powers'll work fine with the kukri, though.

tuxedoraptor · Aug 11, 2017

Well, it looks like our rogue wasted a feat then. She was aiming to go for daggermaster with a kukuri. Oh well, she doesn't really have any backstory outside of she was dumped at an orphanage dedicated to the raven queen holding a letter. Shes now seeking her parents. She is a rogue since shes a vigilante style character. I personally don't know what makes the daggermaster such a great paragon path, but if thats what my players want, so be it. I believe we shifted away from "venca wants to cause an undead uprising" to "there will be an undead uprising, but its hard to tell who is involved" Our deathwarden is probably the most unique character I have seen in a while. Deathwardens use shields as implements, are proficent in military heavy thrown weapons, chainmail,leather and hide armor and are either intelligence or constitution based with wisdom as their primary stat. They can also spend healing surges to detach their souls, allowing them to scout ahead briefly. Ours is intelligence based, uses hide armor and a trident, as well as a light shield. Occasionally he throws hammers.

Tony Vargas · Aug 11, 2017

tuxedoraptor said:
Well, it looks like our rogue wasted a feat then. She was aiming to go for daggermaster with a kukuri.

Seems like you're doing frequent re-builds so NBD.

She is a rogue since shes a vigilante style character. I personally don't know what makes the daggermaster such a great paragon path

Crit on an 18-20. At paragon & epic, crits can be pretty dramatic, and most ways of getting 19-20 crit are to be found at epic ('jagged' weapons crit 19-20 at lower levels for 'mere' ongoing damage, and are still also notorious for that reason; similarly notorious, the Radiant Servant PP crits with radiant powers on a 19-20 at paragon), but 18-20 is a real outlier.

AbdulAlhazred · Aug 12, 2017

Tony Vargas said:
Seems like you're doing frequent re-builds so NBD.
Crit on an 18-20. At paragon & epic, crits can be pretty dramatic, and most ways of getting 19-20 crit are to be found at epic ('jagged' weapons crit 19-20 at lower levels for 'mere' ongoing damage, and are still also notorious for that reason; similarly notorious, the Radiant Servant PP crits with radiant powers on a 19-20 at paragon), but 18-20 is a real outlier.

Yeah, there are a number of ways to juice up crits. So it is a path of rich optimization. As for the 're-builds', you can simply change a weapon proficiency feat (or whatever feat grants it) as retraining. Keep the Kukri and just trade back to regular dagger at paragon, IE 'learn the path of the dagger' or whatever.

tuxedoraptor · Aug 12, 2017

Well, my players tend to make a bunch of characters they want to try out and at earlier levels I am more inclined to say yes. They have reached level two though! Now we just need to see if they can make it to level five. I gave them inherent bonuses so jagged daggers shouldn't be a problem. Magic items are avaliable, just rather hard to get. They currently are trying to find the goblin chieftan who is causing raids on a local village. I have a very terrifying surprise planned for them though. The goblins aren't raiding, they are fleeing. Also, I did take the advice of mainly using MM3 and MV for monsters, but my players felt that the fights were ending way too fast or were just boring. I am now using MM1 and MM2 since they are described as tougher to beat.

Tony Vargas · Aug 12, 2017

MM1 & 2 monsters tend to do a bit less damage, but there are a few that do too much - rather like the issues with 5e CR, just fixed in the first year or so.
The solos & elites tend to have too-high defenses, which is only a serious problem at the ragged edge of encounter design, level+4 and up. But, they're also very vulnerable to lockdown/action-denial.

4e characters can have so much to do and/or that can take rounds to come to fruition, that an early victory can sometimes be a let-down. Just save that stuff for a biggervor tougher fight.

But short & boring sounds like you might be using 4e standard monster level like 3e CR, which'd be radically under powered, even for a party of three.

Then there's the 3pp classes I never heard of and the likelihood you're running w/o errata (updates)...

D&D 4E New gamemaster to 4e

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