Should the DMG suggest improv and acting classes?

Playing RPGs IS and improv class.

Geeknamese said:

I think you may be missing the point of what improv classes are. It's not about perfecting your performance or playing a character, etc. That's what regular acting classes are for. Improv classes are for learning how to think on the fly, flow with the scene, riff off what is happening at the present moment and letting go and taking chances. Improv classes would help any player or DM improve with D&D.

I agree with most that improv classes shouldn't be mentioned as a requirement or suggestion to better DMing but there should be improv tips, as iserith, suggested which could enhance play.


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That's interesting and does sound cool, however I think most people when they see the word "improv" think of things like "who's line is it anyway?" and other improv comedy performances and that's where the intimidating part comes in. It sounds like you're going to be on a stage with a group of people and being asked to perform.

Illithidbix said:

I also think there are many things about (some) improv acting which are quite counter to roleplay, despite seeming very similar at first glance.

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I think the main difference between improv and roleplay is more based upon the RPG that is being played than it is the entire genre of RPG in general. The biggest disconnect of course is that many RPGs have the Game Master-- the person who has a story and meta-knowledge of what is happening in that story so that the story can be directed, whereas in most improvisation all the participants go in with virtually no information whatsoever. All background is created on the spot, all characters are created on the spot, and the story is "found" by the participants based upon what each of them offer as a truth and is then built on.

However, there are many RPGs that have come to the fore in the last decade or so that are basically built for structured improvisation. There are no GMs involved, and there is little story "pre-plotted" beforehand... the games give you a series of basic dollops of information to use, the same way an improv troupe would ask for a suggestion from the audience in which to base their scene. So something like Fiasco gives the participants a genre for their story, a character for each player, and a series of way those character already know and relate to each other. But after that, the story is found and discovered through play... and not because an outside player has a world already crafted and has storylines set up to narrate the other players through.

That doesn't change the fact though that the techniques improvisation teaches people about listening, making choices, and reacting are all fundemental parts of communal story-telling. And the more you can do those things naturally and without even thinking about them, the less chance fear has to take hold and the less chance you are going to put up blocks because you're afraid of not being ready for where you all are going. It's a really hard and counter-intuitive thing-- to care enough about a character to want to see it move and grow and really push it forward... but at the same time be perfectly okay with letting it go-- having it make bad choices, or embrace its failings, or accept when things have gone wrong. To not give in to the fear of seeing your "baby" fall and desperately working dishonestly to keep it from happening.

robus said:

It sounds like you're going to be on a stage with a group of people and being asked to perform.

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That's kind of what a gaming session is though, right? It just the group performing is also the audience.

So the things that make improv theater work well also make D&D work well.

iserith said:

That's kind of what a gaming session is though, right? It just the group performing is also the audience.

So the things that make improv theater work well also make D&D work well.

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Well the word "perform" is the problem. For some people that sounds like hell on earth. Not me - I love to ham it up (hence I'm the DM ) but for others, they would hate it.

robus said:

Well the word "perform" is the problem. For some people that sounds like hell on earth. Not me - I love to ham it up (hence I'm the DM ) but for others, they would hate it.

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I can see that. I see "perform" in this context as just playing, not acting or the like.

More valuable would be books/classes on writing and storytelling, but I wouldn't put that in the DMG either.

Tony Vargas said:

You don't have to say no to narrate failure.

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If Bêlit misses an attack or fails an ability check then we should certainly narrate the result. Instead of saying, "You fail to open the door.", it is better to say something like, "Bêlit strains her muscles, but the door remains closed." Or perhaps we use fail-forward and say, "Bêlit opens the door, but it makes a massive noise as it hits the wall on the other side, probably alerting everyone in the building."

What I was thinking when I made my post was not failure of an attempt but an attempt to do something against the rules, leading to the GM to put on her referee hat.

Greenstone.Walker said:

What I was thinking when I made my post was not failure of an attempt but an attempt to do something against the rules, leading to the GM to put on her referee hat.

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I would say that sort of thing exists outside of the improvisation and isn't subject to the obligation to say "Yes, and..."

robus said:

That's interesting and does sound cool, however I think most people when they see the word "improv" think of things like "who's line is it anyway?" and other improv comedy performances and that's where the intimidating part comes in. It sounds like you're going to be on a stage with a group of people and being asked to perform.

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That is what most people think of when they hear improv. But improv is really a skill, people use it to devise scripted shows as well.

Beginner improv students range from performers who want to do live comedy shows, to actors who have never improvised a show, business-people who want to improve their public speaking, and sometimes people who just think it would be interesting to take a class.