D&D 4E Towards a Story Now 4e

Here's some more meaty crunch to chew on. Perhaps not as exciting, we're pretty solidly in d20 land here. Aside from variable levels of success that is...
Core Mechanic


HoML is based on one simple core rule system, the check. A check is a toss of one or two d20 which is made in order to determine the outcome of some kind of character action. The basic idea is a fairly simple and familiar roll high mechanic using a 20-sided die, somewhat similar to various other popular role-playing games.
Whenever the Game Master decides that a creature must overcome some sort of obstacle, defeat an opponent, or perform some action which is beyond the ordinary, a check will be called for. Note that if a character is simply doing something ordinary, under conditions where an ordinary person could predictably get good results, then no check is required. Checks resolve, or help to resolve conflict, they aren't intended as a mere randomization mechanism. When a check is made, something is at stake and the die will tell you what the results and consequences of the character's action are.


In most cases some sort of modifiers will be applied to a check. These may be ability modifiers, level modifiers, proficiency modifiers, and/or permanent modifiers. The player will roll d20 (usually one, sometimes 2) and add or subtract all relevant modifiers to produce a result. If the result equals or exceeds the difficulty value (DV) set by the Game Master then the character succeeds in the check. If the roll is above the DV by less than 5 points, the character achieves a basic level of success, whatever task the character was attempting succeeds in the normal way. If the check is 5 or more points beyond the DV then the success is complete and the character achieves some sort of 'extra' success called Complete Success. If the player fails to roll the DV or higher then a consequence occurs. If this check is more than 5 points short of the DV, then the character suffers a more significant complication or setback which they will have to overcome. In general failures within 5 points of the DV should allow the character's goals to be advanced, but not in a way that was intended. For example if the character fell off a ledge they might be hanging on to a bit of rope or a tree root and subject to attack, but still have an opportunity to regain a safe footing or try another plan. With limited success the character has, for example, avoided a fall. With a complete success the character might gain some sort of advantage.
Modifiers

Modifiers are bonuses or penalties to the check value which reflect something about the character which makes her more or less able to succeed at this sort of check. Normally modifiers don't change, except when something changes about the character, thus they shouldn't have to be recalculated or figured very often.


Ability modifiers are determined by the ability value of the rolling character's applicable ability. Generally, for any given check, one ability will be applicable. For a feat of strength the character's strength ability value would be used. A character with a strength of Strong(+3) has an associated +3 ability modifier and would thus add 3 to his check when attempting to lift a heavy object. Likewise if a character were attempting to dodge a poison dart fired by a trap she would make a check using her dexterity ability modifier. Permanent Modifiers are modifiers which are applied for other reasons than ability score. These are generally the result of a character having a particular boon or limitation. Only one permanent modifier, the one most favorable to the creature making the check, is applicable. For example a character might have a permanent -2 modifier to all wisdom checks to resist fear due to a curse, but if the character also had a +2 modifier to resist fear checks because they were equipped with an Amulet of Bravery boon then the character would have a +2 modifier. Permanent modifiers rarely change during play except in exceptional situations.
Level Modifier is a modifier which all Characters are granted based on their level. This modifier can be found on the difficulty chart. This represents the character's increasing skill, luck, and confidence. Higher level characters are greater heroes and thus are more easily capable of achieving all manner of tasks.
Proficiency Modifier is a modifier which is applied when a character is using a skill in which they are trained, a weapon with which they are proficient, have specific knowledge, or in any similar situation. This modifier is always +5.

Note that the sum of these modifiers should be a single overall total modifier that will only change as the character acquires or loses boons, gains levels, etc. Frequently used total modifiers can be written on a character's sheet for reference. This normally includes total attack modifiers, total skill modifiers, etc.
Bonus Stacking

Bonuses don't stack within a category. Each check can receive no more than one permanent modifier, one proficiency modifier, one level modifier, and one ability modifier. This will be the most favorable such modifier (the highest one).
Difficulty Value

Each check has a difficulty value (hereafter referred to as DV). The DV of a check is the value which the roll must equal or exceed once all modifiers are applied in order for the check to succeed.
In HoML DVs are each assigned a level. This allows the GM to quickly determine just how hard a given check is vs the capabilities of the PCs involved. If a check has the DV for the level of the character making it this will be a moderate difficulty check. A check at level +5 would probably be difficult and require a trained character, advantage, or at least a high ability score to pass. A check at level -5 should be trivial for most PCs, but an especially incompetent or disadvantaged character might still fail now and then.
Throughout the rest of the rules checks will be rated by level, not DV. To determine the DV refer back to the accompanying chart. The overall difficulty of performing tasks can be adjusted by the GM simply by changing the values on this table, for instance to make the character's higher level abilities less fantastic in nature the DV values could be increased at higher levels. Note that DVs are noted for levels up to 25. While PCs normally won't be above level 20 they might still encounter checks of greater difficulty. A level 25 check is presumably about the most difficult possible task in the game.
Defenses

Sometimes, usually an attack, a DV will be derived from a character's defenses. These are values which indicate how resistant a character is to various sorts of attacks. In this case the defense value is used as the DV of the check. Defenses are covered later in the section on character attributes.

[MENTION=82106]AbdulAlhazred[/MENTION], you need to fix your tables in that post!

pemerton said:

@AbdulAlhazred, you need to fix your tables in that post!

Click to expand...

I hate bbcode! Weirdly between LibreOffice cutting and FireFox and the inline editor pasting, it actually manages to translate all the coding for the whole document pretty well. Except when you save tables in editor wysiwyg mode, it blows away the width setting and they fail Its like, you got me 99.9% of the way there, and then failed! lol.

Note to the administration here. HTML is a good thing, enable it!

OK, anyway, that was mostly kinda crunchy stuff. We're in d20 land here. I like that, others may question the reason for bothering, but D&D still has the best character power growth model in the business, so we're going to use it!

[h=2]Advantage and Disadvantage
[/h] Temporary circumstances which increase or decrease a character's chances of success at a task are represented by advantage or disadvantage. When a character has advantage the player rolls 2 d20 and picks the one with the higher value, this is the result of the roll. Likewise if a character has disadvantage the player rolls 2 d20 and picks the one with the lower value, this is the result of the roll. If a character has both advantage and disadvantage then the two cancel. Any number of different advantages or disadvantages are canceled by one disadvantage or advantage. Thus if a character was eligible to get advantage due to 3 different circumstances and disadvantage from 1 circumstance then the 2 cancel and the player rolls 1 d20 as normal.

In general if a situation is such that a character is almost bound to succeed then either no check should be called for or the DV should be reduced substantially. Likewise if a character is almost bound to fail due to many adverse circumstances the GM should either raise the DV of the task, or increase the consequences of failure. In general most checks should have neither advantage nor disadvantage and characters (especially player characters) should not be gaining advantage or suffering disadvantage constantly. For instance a character might get advantage for making a surprise attack against an enemy but there should not be a boon which constantly grants advantage to a character when fighting a certain type of foe etc. Situations like this should be dealt with as permanent modifiers instead.


[h=1]Level
[/h] Level is a concept which is used heavily throughout HoML. Each PC and NPC/Monster has a level, each check has a level, each challenge has a level, and many of the game's boons, actions, and powers are assigned a level as well. In all cases level defines the overall significance or difficulty of a thing. These levels range from level 1, the least difficult or significant, to level 20 and beyond, the highest levels of difficulty and significance.

Each character has a level attribute. The character's level determines the character's overall power. A higher level character is more potent than a lower level one. In HoML character levels range from starting heroes at level 1 up to mythic heroes which have finished level 20. However NPCs may be above level 20. Once a PC reaches level 20 they no longer advance in levels, though they may still gain new boons etc. A character which is eligible to be level 21 is usually considered to have passed beyond the mortal realm, faded into myth, etc. The GM may have some further ideas about what happens to level 20+ characters.
Character levels are used in a pretty straightforward way to allow the GM to gauge what sorts of scenarios provide a challenge for a given group of characters. Each NPC/monster has a level, which indicates what level of PC that monster will provide a degree of challenge to in a fight or other similar situation. Other elements of the game, such as hazardous terrain, traps, and other similar things are also assignable to a level, indicating the level of PC they represent a degree of challenge for. The GM will usually try to arrange scenarios such that the dangers and difficulties the characters match their skills against are roughly near their level.

Each check is also assigned a level, which is used to determine its DV (see core mechanic above). Additionally entire challenges are assigned a level, indicating the overall difficulty of the scenario and what level of PCs it challenges. Usually the individual elements of a challenge will fall close to the level of the challenge as a whole, but there may be considerable variation depending on the details of the challenge.

[h=2]Tiers of Play[/h] The 20 levels of HoML are divided up into three tiers of play. Within each tier the game assumes a particular flavor of play and certain assumptions are made about the place of characters of each tier in the world. When characters advance from one tier to the next they begin to enter a different arena for their adventures, one of wider scope, greater challenge, and mightier foes and rewards.

[h=3]Heroic Tier[/h] Characters of levels 1 to 8 are heroes. During this tier of play they will be faced with situations which would test the most capable of ordinary people. Their abilities will be extraordinary, but rarely entirely fantastic. They will face fearsome monsters, evil mages, cunning traps, and adventure in the wilds, ruins, and cities of the world. By the end of heroic tier the characters will be potent heroes, well-known to the people of their homeland. A level 8 Warrior might be the King's Champion, the Mystic might be an adviser to the Court, etc.
Heroic characters walk, or ride. They wield powers which are amazing but within the limits of what is known and possible within their (albeit magical) world. A heroic warrior might slay many orcs with his heirloom sword, and endure attacks that would kill most men. There are still others in the kingdom who can challenge him however, and his reputation is still being founded.

[h=3]Legendary Tier
[/h] Characters of levels 9 through 16 are legends. They have surpassed all but the very greatest of people in history and will be remembered for their deeds long after their passing. Their abilities will be beyond those of ordinary men, becoming extraordinary in nature. Mighty barbarians slay great giants, erudite wizards weave amazing spells, and cunning rogues dazzle dragons. The characters will face powerful dragons, awesome giants, travel to the farthest reaches of the world, and battle its most powerful denizens.
Legendary characters ride famous mounts the likes of which are rarely, if ever, seen in the land. They may harness magic to fly or even teleport. Legendary warriors slay entire companies of orcs single-handed and best mighty giants one-on-one. Their swords have names and stories of their own. They can fly into battle, or sneak past even the most watchful guards. Nobody in the history of their land has been mightier, and only the most powerful figures in the entire world can challenge them.
[h=3]Mythic Tier[/h] Characters of level 17 and above are myths. They have surpassed even the most mighty legends of the past and become the greatest warriors, mystics, and tricksters of all time. Their feats will be remembered as long as stories are told until the ending of the world. Their foes are equally mighty, beings so powerful they are only spoken of in the same stories as the very gods themselves. Indeed mythic characters can expect to interact with divine forces, travel to far worlds, and undertake impossible quests. Mythic knights slay the mother of all dragons, unmatched sorcerers forge unique world-shaking magics, and mythical rogues steal the secrets of the very gods themselves.
Mythic characters have no equals in the world at all. No warrior in history has slain the king of the giants in his own hall in the mountains of ice at the world's heart. When mythic characters travel, they invoke mighty magics, ride dragons, and the earth trembles at their coming. They split mountains, unleash magics which reshape the world, and reweave the very strands of fate itself.

[h=3]Apotheosis
[/h] Once a character reaches level 20, her career as an adventurer reaches its peak and comes to an end. The character will achieve his final goals, sail off into the sunset, pass beyond the realms of the living, or perhaps fall into final and uttermost oblivion. Such a character is unlikely to reappear as a PC in future adventures, her story is finished. Perhaps a favorite character might make a cameo appearance in an interlude in a later game!
[h=1]Stacking[/h] There are many kinds of bonuses which can be added to different character attributes and other values in HoML. In the section on the Core Mechanic stacking was explained in reference to modifiers to checks. Other bonuses apply in basically the same way. Each bonus is of one of the four types, ability, proficiency, level, or permanent. Only the largest bonus of each type may be applied to any given attribute. Note that ability, level and proficiency bonuses often don't apply at all to many attributes (level isn't important to them, they simply aren't dependent on an ability and there is no related skill proficiency). However some items or boons might still provide such bonuses, and other attributes will apply them. Each attribute has its own rules as to calculating a value for it. In no case will 2 bonuses of the same type ever stack, you must always choose the highest one to apply.
For Example: A character uses a power to make an attack and hits her opponent. The damage roll might be made with a d10 and the power might specify a STR bonus. She might also have a +2 permanent modifier to damage rolls against this kind of opponent. If she also had another +1 permanent modifier to all damage rolls it wouldn’t stack with the +2, only the best one would be used.

[h=1]Keywords[/h] Keywords are a core concept in HoML. A keyword may be attached to almost any element of the game, such as a power, an attribute of a character, the entire character itself, a monster, etc. Keywords indicate a category into which the thing bearing the keyword falls. Thus a character who is of the eldar race will have the fey keyword, because the eldar are fey creatures. An item might have an attribute something like:
Cold Iron Sword = +4 permanent bonus to all attacks on fey creatures when using this weapon.

This rule would be triggered when an attack was made on an eldar character. Likewise if a power or effect has a keyword, such as 'poison' this might interact with a dwarf character's 'Resistant' trait, granting him a +5 permanent modifier on any checks related to poison.

Keywords frequently appear in another context, they describe damage. For instance a magical fireball might produce damage with the keyword 'fire'. Characters may have immunity from, vulnerability to, or protection from specific keywords. Otherwise damage keywords largely work in the same way as other keywords, providing an extra level of narrative description and allowing the GM and players to make changes to the mechanics where narratively appropriate. For example a GM might determine that fire damage is halved when the target is under water.

OK, I skipped over some "this is boring and pretty much stock d20" kinds of parts. Couple rules here, the ONLY situational modifier in this game is advantage/disadvantage!!!! KISS. I don't think people care about this little plussy and that little plussy, if it isn't worth an effective +/- 4 then piss on it!

The stacking rule reiterates, nothing stacks, not never ever ever! TBH the math almost works out a bit 5e-like, though coming from a very different angle. You get about +2/3 levels as a level bonus, but your other bonuses are fairly tamer since they aren't stacking. Note that proficiency is set at 4e's +5 bonus for a trained skill. Given other factors you CAN operate without proficiency in something, but it helps a whole lot. Some talented untrained PCs will rival trained ones, but you want to have all the nice bennies to be truly the bestest everest!

Note the level breakdown, 20 levels (mainly to make it easier to not have any boring ones frankly) with only the last 3 being 'Mythic'. You get to be pretty much gonzo for 3 levels. That's still a good solid extended story arc, do you really need more? At the end you go to your final rewards, yay! Frankly this game is designed to actually play through, not for the top tier levels to be some sort of almost-never-achieved Valhalla.

Finally Keywords are doing their job, this is nothing new, but I am being a lot more explicit about how things hang off this.

Thinking about whether the topic is best served by posting chunks of rule text or not. Or at least I don't think it is that sensible to post big chunks of crunchy stuff when we all probably have read plenty of this type of material before!

I'm going to just post a few points from the 'Characters' section, which provides a full description of all the stuff that could appear on a character sheet in HoML. Suffice it to say you have D&D style ability scores! Here's a bit that should start showing where I want PCs to go

[h=2]Character Traits
[/h] Each PC starts the game with three character traits. These attributes describe the character in narrative terms. Players are free to invent any specific traits they wish, but three are suggested, a strength, a weakness, and a goal. Other traits may be generated as desired by the players and GM as well during the course of play. Options might include beliefs, interests, fears, etc.
Character traits are the attributes which are used to drive the character’s story. They should be evocative, interesting, and speak to the character’s nature, agenda, and needs. When the GM creates challenges for the PCs he will use these traits to decide what will engage a given character.
For example: If a player describes his character as ‘honest to a fault’ then the GM is likely to test his honesty. What price will he pay to remain honest? Is he naive, or highly principled? How will he cope with a situation where his honesty will hurt others?
Traits are also used to govern the use of Inspiration.
[h=2]Inspiration[/h] At any given time a character either has inspiration available, or not. Usually a character will be granted inspiration at the start of a session of play. Later the player may spend the inspiration, or acquire it again based on actions governed by the character's traits. See the section on Inspiration later in these rules for more information.

Hit points are hit points, Gygax pretty well nailed that one and we're not improving on it here....

[h=2]Vitality
[/h] In addition to hit points each character also has a vitality attribute. This has a numeric value which represents the number of vitality points the character can expend. Vitality points may be used for a wide variety of things. They can be used to power an extra action, as a reserve of durability which a hero can dig into in order to restore his or her hit points, or a resource which can be used to power magic items, spells, or other extraordinary abilities of a character. Generally speaking only PCs have non-zero vitality. Most NPCs lack the connections to fate and destiny which translate into vitality points.

PCs each receive 8 vitality points at first level and receive another 1 at each of 9^th and 17^th levels. Vitality points are recovered as determined by the GM, see the discussion of rest and recovery in the Adventuring section of the rules.

I want to simplify things, so I decided that it was pointless to have separate action points, etc. and just have one set of 'vitality points' which can be used like HS and AP as well as for other things (the main one being power recharge). So basically, if they're going to be used in many ways, then we can't really give out different amounts of them to different classes like in standard 4e... Also, by removing these class differences we make it easier to make use of different game elements in new ways, a wizard isn't ALWAYS a guy with few hit points who cannot take punishment. That might not be the typical wizard in terms of how they play out, but...


[h=2]Damage Resistance[/h] Each character has a damage resistance attribute. Whenever a character takes damage its damage resistance value is subtracted from the damage taken. Damage resistance is primarily provided by armor, but may also be a result of various boons, the effects of powers, etc. Note that damage resistance values may or may not stack, depending on how they are worded. A power might grant “Damage resistance 5”, which sets the character's damage resistance at this value. A magic ring might grant a +1 permanent bonus to damage resistance, which is added to whatever the character has already. A character with both of the above effects in play would have a damage resistance of 6, the highest specific value acts as a base, but bonuses stack on top of that, subject to the general stacking rule (only one bonus of each type). Damage Resistance is usually abbreviated 'DR'.
I did away with AC! Again, this is just simpler, there's no longer this weird extra defense which sort of logically should overlap with the others anyway (why do some attacks only care about your armor and not how tough you are or if you can dodge well?). Every attack goes against one of the 3 4e-style defenses, and THEN your armor takes a bite out of the damage! This can create problems, I know, but it also solved a whole bunch of things in 4e real quick.

I'd also note that DR applies to all sorts of damage. Yes, this means the guy in plate armor resists fear and etc. better. That might offend you, well too bad! I look at it this way, cladding yourself in plate armor is a way of saying you are a tough walking tank of a guy, and if that means you don't chicken out easily, well, is that so crazy?


[h=2]Background
[/h] Each character may have additional background elements. These help to round out the character and fill in details of his or her story. They may also point out areas where the character has some special knowledge, or other minor boon, which may be noted. There are several categories of background element:

1. Parentage – Who were the characters parents, what was their position in society, etc.
   
2. Occupation – What did the character do before he became a hero?
   
3. Society – What was the character's role and position in society?
   
4. Geography – Where did the character live?
   
5. Bonds – Who did the character know?
   

Most characters will have at most one of each of these five categories of background element, but these are only suggestions, players should feel free to add other types, forgo using some of these, or even use more than one of the same type if it works for them.
I really had little to say about classes and races that 4e doesn't say. Backgrounds are pretty similar in theory, BUT here you get specialized knowledge (IE proficiency bonus if something fits closely with your backstory) and you can invoke these elements like character traits witn your Inspiration. This is definitely encouraging players to create a solid backstory and use these elements to make it interesting.

Now, the next section I tackled was character generation. This was done back in the early phase of constructing the rules so that people could actually get into a game (kinda useful, that) but lately I've thought that I'm missing an opportunity there to make it into a true character building process instead of just a cookbook. Anyway, that's a topic for next time.

[h=1]Character Generation
[/h] When a player desires to create a player character, the following procedure can be followed. Note that at times GMs may decide to make modifications to this process to reflect differences in genre or setting in a particular game. It may also be that a higher than level 1 PC is desired. In that case the player and GM will need to determine what boons the character has. The Worlds & Play book has some guidelines that the GM may choose to follow in this case.

[h=3]Generate Ability Scores
[/h] Standard Array: The simplest way to do this is to take the standard sequence of bonuses, +3, +2, +1, +1, +1, +1 and apply them in any order to your character. Another option is to use the point system outlined below
Point Value: Start with 9 points. Each point of ability score modifier costs one point. A character could be Strong in 3 areas and poor in the other 3, or any other combination adding up to 9 points of modifiers.

Remember, your character will probably receive a racial bonus to at least one ability score. Using this system you can produce a character with potentially up to a +5 starting bonus in a given ability value, although this will probably limit the character significantly in other areas. Consider applying a 'well rounded character' rule when using point buy. This limits all starting attributes to at most +3 (which allows for a +4 with most common racial bonuses). Doing so makes +5 an aspirational goal instead of an optimum starting bonus.

I think I skipped the ability score rule in the character rules before because it really wasn't anything super radical, but I am just dealing with 'ability bonus' in 4e terms, and not bothering with the pretense of the 3-18 scores. I don't have to slavishly maintain obsolescent constructs in my game merely to be nice to tradition!

So the question is how would this section become part of a more 'narrative' approach to character generation? How about if we were to start off with the question of the character's origin, and then use that to suggest race, class, and ability scores? I think ability score would almost be the last major decision we'd make, then the numbers would get filled in. Maybe I'll just try writing a replacement chapter over the next couple days and see how that goes. Anyway, I won't recapitulate the minor details, except we get down to an interesting part after we pick race and class, picking the backgrounds mentioned in the previous section!

Currently it just says "pick up to 5 background elements", one of each type. Sure can make THAT more narrative!


[h=3]Calculate Hit Points and Vitality
[/h] Note the hit point base amount provided by your race, add 10 plus your CON to this. This is your hit point total. Divide this number by 4, rounding down; this is your Healing Value. You start with 8 vitality points.
[h=3]Choose Starting Boons[/h] Each character may start the game with 3 major boons, selected from those available to the character's class, race, and background. You may select one from each, or any other combination which totals 3 boons. Additionally the GM may allow characters to pick one or more of these from any other boons that are available to level 1 characters. Characters automatically receive any minor boons provided by their class, race, or background as listed.
[h=3]Pick Skills[/h] Note which skills your character's race, class, and background make them eligible to be trained in. Pick 3 skills from this list, the character has training in these 3 skills; certain boons may provide additional skill training, record these as well.
[h=3]Pick Proficiencies[/h] Most classes define certain weapon and implement proficiencies that the character gains. Some backgrounds, races, and boons may also offer proficiency with various types of equipment. Select your proficiencies and record them.
[h=3]Character Traits[/h] Devise three character traits for your character, a strength, a weakness, and a goal. Note that your character will start the first session of the game with Inspiration.

Notice that hit points really doesn't vary by class. There's a theme here, classes are a bit mechanically less significant than they are in 4e. Still important though.

Boons are basically mentioned for the first time here. Much more will be presented on that subject at a later time!

Note that everyone gets 3 skills (though getting a 4th one is not at all hard, I assume most characters have 4-5 skills when all is said and done, but you could be stuck with 3 if you're really determined not to pick any boons that help with that).

Traits are pretty straightforward. You can actually pick other things. I think I want to actually lead with this subject and elaborate on it, then use it to drive the rest of the design process.

I'm going to skip the rest of this section, it is just basically explaining how the numbers work and where to write them on your sheet. Defenses, etc pretty much work as we would expect, so not much to tell.


The final piece of the basic character rules is advancement, which I will touch on next time!

AbdulAlhazred said:

Notice that hit points really doesn't vary by class. There's a theme here, classes are a bit mechanically less significant than they are in 4e. Still important though.

Click to expand...

if a class gets a boost to their damage resistance.... that would put it in.

I had considered back in 1e days of giving every class d8 hit points and the fighter 1 damage resistance and a hit point cost for most spell casting.

LOL flash backs

Garthanos said:

if a class gets a boost to their damage resistance.... that would put it in.

I had considered back in 1e days of giving every class d8 hit points and the fighter 1 damage resistance and a hit point cost for most spell casting.

LOL flash backs

Click to expand...

Yup! If you want to hang in the front rank, donning up a suite of Scale Armor (DR3) sure makes sense! I guess I haven't really had to think about why wizards and such wouldn't just put some on as well, though crunchy reasons like movement rate, encumbrance, and check penalty might account for it.

I guess in truth there's really no particular reason NOT to just go with parties loaded up with armor.

AbdulAlhazred said:

I guess in truth there's really no particular reason NOT to just go with parties loaded up with armor.

Click to expand...

armor training is ahem realistically wierd however "The defender classes" having actual defense training and skills like the berserker having 2 points better ac when in defender mode, makes a lot of sense. And could translate to class skill which created effective DR against attacks they were aware of.

1e put arbitrary restrictions on it... also others asserted flavorful ie iron didn't work so well with magic use

Garthanos said:

armor training is ahem realistically wierd however "The defender classes" having actual defense training and skills like the berserker having 2 points better ac when in defender mode, makes a lot of sense. And could translate to class skill which created effective DR against attacks they were aware of.

1e put arbitrary restrictions on it... also others asserted flavorful ie iron didn't work so well with magic use

Click to expand...

Right, so we have 3 basic routes which D&D has taken in the past

1) absolute restrictions (all versions of classic D&D, though mysteriously elves don't count, lol).
2) Disadvantages (actually has any version simply relied on this? I don't think so, but its an option).
3) Proficiency (only 4e did this).

Personally I'm not fond of #3 because it both quashes the notion of gearing up appropriately for different situations, AND its pretty hard to understand what sort of a proficiency wearing armor is. I've worn some reproduction armors of various sorts. Yeah, putting them on certainly takes a bit of figuring out, but EVERY SUIT IS UNIQUE so having 'plate armor proficiency' makes zero sense in this respect. Beyond that there's just really nothing TO wearing armor, you just friggin wear it! Obviously reality is no obstacle to FRPG rules, but still!

Disadvantages sounds promising as a way of driving some sort of calculation of trade-offs, both between PCs habitual wearing habits, and any situations where characters might change up for specific scenarios. However, DR is REALLY REALLY potent. In a game where your average level 1 monster is going to do something like 6.4 DPR, then 4 points of DR is a HUGE win. Even 2 points is a big win! This means either you have a very small range of armor types, or you're going to need some humongous and entirely unrealistic disadvantages, or a lot of realism to capture the more subtle but realistic reasons people don't traipse around in suites of armor all day. I'm not super fond of any of those.

That leaves absolute restrictions, or variations thereon such as your "magic doesn't like metal" kind of rule. In basic terms I kind of hate it because its so arbitrary. I want choices to be driven by logic, not by fiat, when possible. This makes the world seem more natural. Magic doesn't like metal OTOH at least is a consistent rule (elves get the shaft!) and nobody can complain about its realism, that's for sure.

I dunno. Maybe its just best to assume that most of the time most PCs will just all turtle up! You'll still get the odd outlier, and always possible to code in an exception like barbarians that just get their DR for chutzpah or something and go around half naked. If Conan wants to armor up, well it can still work, it just doesn't stack with his natural armor. Wizards could then be forced to choose between powers and armor, not a hard choice to make. Rogues might still choose light armor to avoid some check penalties that might not deter a fighter, but could well change the mind of a guy who likes to sneak around and isn't planning to hang around in the faces of any brutes. I guess there COULD still be something like a proficiency for heavy armor that you need to get in order to remove some basically ridiculous penalty. That would probably deter your average rogue and maybe some others a bit more.

So far, TBH, I've found that players pretty much went with armor based on their idea of their character, and since they've all played a good bit of D&D they tend to have internalized that. As it stands it isn't really well enforced in HoML though, encumbrance is a thing, but not super important, and there isn't an easy way to do a check penalty, nor is movement rate reduction a very potent deterrent in reality.