Breaking Bounded Accuracy: Proposed Fix

dave2008 · Nov 12, 2018

From time to time I have pondered about what to do about the compounding effects of magic equipment and buffing spells. Basically I feel that these two together break bounded accuracy (typically in favor of the PCs). My current solution is to not give out + magic items. However, I was thinking about another option.

Here is my proposed solution: magic doesn't stack. Whatever magic gives you a bonus to a roll (not disadvantage or advantage) cannot stake with another type of magic that gives you a bonus to the same roll.

Example: Fighter Bob has a +3 longsword and Cleric Jane cast bless on him (rolling 2). Bob only gets his +3 bonus from the sword on his attack roll, but he still gets the +2 bonus to his saving throws from bless.

I can bet this breaks something else, but I am not sure what. Any thoughts?

EDIT: Break is to strong of a word, I think stacking magic bends BA further than I like.

EDIT 2: To clarify the bold part above, I am not looking for alternate solutions. I am asking if the proposed solution has ramifications I am not thinking about.

Sorcerers Apprentice · Nov 12, 2018

No need to fix something that isn't broken.

Also, you have the effect of Bless wrong. You roll the d4 every time you make an Attack Roll or Saving Throw, not once when the spell is cast.

dave2008 · Nov 13, 2018

Sorcerers Apprentice said:
No need to fix something that isn't broken.

Also, you have the effect of Bless wrong. You roll the d4 every time you make an Attack Roll or Saving Throw, not once when the spell is cast.

Like I clarified, it isn't broken, but a bit bent IMO. I want to straighten it out a little

It is an issue for some, so I am looking for suggestions for a fix, not a dismissal of the issue. If it is not an issue for you and your group - great! But it is an issue for me, and I have seen it be an issue for others on these forums.

Also, you misunderstood (or assumed I did) what my point about bless was. When bless is cast, Bob doesn't get any benefit on his attack rolls, but he still does on his saving throws. I was not trying to state that it is only rolled once (which is irrelevant anyway).

Pauln6 · Nov 13, 2018

I rule magic plusses on armour and shields don't stack but most resource based stuff is fine.
Possibly ogre power and giant strength might need a fix. My preferred option is +2 strength capped at 19, wearer treated as large for tests of strength, carrying, and lifting or +4 capped as per the type of belt, wearer treated as huge for tests of strength, carrying and lifting.

Oofta · Nov 13, 2018

I think you're trying to fix something that's not broken. Don't hand out +3 weapons or belts of giant strength. Bless requires concentration so target the caster.

Or just don't worry about it and if the PCs are stomping on your encounters raise your XP budget a bit to compensate.

The Crimson Binome · Nov 13, 2018

It could just be that bless is too good, given the normalization effect of rolling an extra die. Are there other spells or effects that you're having a problem with? It could be as simple as getting rid of that one spell.

Krachek · Nov 13, 2018

If anything is to avoid it is +x shield and armor.

GreyLord · Nov 13, 2018

It isn't broken, it just doesn't fit in the dynamic of the game you are utilizing.

In various different games with different groups of players I cater to different styles. With one type of style if they DO NOT have these types of bonuses they will die...point blank. I can kill a level 20 party of 5 members with 8 Hill Giants (a CR FAR below what is typical) simply with a few tweaks to items that focus on the players weak saves and using smart tactics if the group isn't composed of really good players.

On the otherhand, I can have that same bunch of Hill Giants killed by a party of 4 fifth level characters who have no magic items simply by playing a straightforward combat if the players use good tactics.

It's not necessarily about the CR and balance in that way, but HOW you DM and play the game and cater to different playstyles.

dave2008 · Nov 13, 2018

Oofta said:
I think you're trying to fix something that's not broken. Don't hand out +3 weapons or belts of giant strength. Bless requires concentration so target the caster.

Or just don't worry about it and if the PCs are stomping on your encounters raise your XP budget a bit to compensate.

Did you read the OP? I said that is my current solution, but that I am looking for a different option. I also clarified in the OP that it is not broken, but "bent" and I want an adjustment. I've been playing 5e since it came out, so I know how to make the encounters that challenge my group. I am looking for a different solution.

dave2008 · Nov 13, 2018

Saelorn said:
It could just be that bless is too good, given the normalization effect of rolling an extra die. Are there other spells or effects that you're having a problem with? It could be as simple as getting rid of that one spell.

Yes, that could be a solution. But I was also trying to find a solution without using the ban hammer. I am also looking for a solution that would work for spells I don't know about or future spells (or magic items) that do similar things.