Will you make transsexual Elves canon in your games ?

Mouseferatu said:

*nod*

I should have been clearer. I was using what you said as a jumping-off point for what I wanted to say, but I was addressing the common topics of "my setting is oppressive because realism" and "in-game oppression of real-world marginalized people" in general, not making a point about your setting in specific.

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Most people get oppressed in my world I dont target anyone in particular. Its up to the PCs to find somewhere where they are not oppressed or create somewhere where they are not oppressed.

Elves don't care about things like sexuality but they have slavery. The Knights of Vanya do not have slavery but they are very humanocentric and conservative. The nice Elven houses want to reform into a human, elven, half elven confederation the nasty ones enslavement and cannon fodder soldiers. There is only 1 good aligned major Elven house though, 4 bad ones and a few minor ones that are "nice"

I like Darksun a lot for example. Everyone's oppressed by the Sorcerer Kings and the alternative is a lot worse (genocide).

Its also an easy way to get heat on NPCs if they are a villain. Just model them on someone in real life who did something nasty by modern standards.

Zardnaar said:

Most people get oppressed in my world I dont target anyone in particular. Its up to the PCs to find somewhere where they are not oppressed or create somewhere where they are not oppressed.

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Sure. I meant it when I said there's great story potential in oppression (as long as all the players are on board with it). The upcoming Lost Citadel campaign I worked on has slavery--particularly of dwarves--as a cornerstone of the city's culture/government.

I just object to people saying their setting is oppressive because they're trying to be "historically accurate," is all.

Mouseferatu said:

Sure. I meant it when I said there's great story potential in oppression (as long as all the players are on board with it). The upcoming Lost Citadel campaign I worked on has slavery--particularly of dwarves--as a cornerstone of the city's culture/government.

I just object to people saying their setting is oppressive because they're trying to be "historically accurate," is all.

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I base some of my cultures on RL ones, classical Greece, Rome, and ancient Egypt.

The European parts are not very ye olde Medieval England/France. If anything its more eastern European the HRE, and the merchant Republics (Venice, Hanseatic League, Ragusa, Genoa etc). Knights of Vanya are basically the Teutonic Order.

I don't play Europa Unversalis IV at all. It not a bad place to look for non Feudal monarchy forms of government though.

@Zardnaar

5% or so self-identify as strictly gay. But bisexuality dramatically increases this percentage.

In settings, it tends to be fun to make about one out ten couples samesex.

• some of these couples are spouses
• some of these couples are close friends
• some of these couples are one-night stands

(Same goes for oppositesex couples.)

Mouseferatu said:

Sure. I meant it when I said there's great story potential in oppression (as long as all the players are on board with it). The upcoming Lost Citadel campaign I worked on has slavery--particularly of dwarves--as a cornerstone of the city's culture/government.

I just object to people saying their setting is oppressive because they're trying to be "historically accurate," is all.

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I think one of the things to make clear in the presentation of any overtly oppressive society is that it's not good. Sure, members of certain races may benefit from civilizations that favor them, but that's not the same as making a positive presentation of the matter. Even oppressive societies know that what they're doing is bad, even if they won't admit it. That's why slaves always get "out of sight" jobs, and slaves that don't (maids, butlers, etc...) get dressed up. Even the common folks at the time saw it for what it was, but typically they were too powerless to do anything about it.

It's why you're more likely to see players object to it, even discounting modern sensibilities: the players have power. Something that most people in an oppressed society fundamentally don't.

Yaarel said:

@Zardnaar

5% or so self-identify as strictly gay. But bisexuality dramatically increases this percentage.

In settings, it tends to be fun to make about one out ten couples samesex.

• some of these couples are spouses
• some of these couples are close friends
• some of these couples are one-night stands

(Same goes for oppositesex couples.)

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As I said I looked at it in and its around 4-5% total. In the USA figures seem to be similar (3.8%). Bi sexual is less than 2%, gay is close to 3% so overall its a bit less than 5% total. The entire LGBT community here is just less than 5%. That is official/confidential census figures in one of the more liberal nations in the world. Sure not everyone might tick the box but its probably higher than 5%.

10% you can use but its around double official numbers from the most liberal nations on the planet. Also see this.
http://news.gallup.com/poll/183383/americans-greatly-overestimate-percent-gay-lesbian.aspx

Before I went digging a couple of days ago my estimate was around 3% so I was slightly off its more than I thought.

Trans basically don't exist form a medical point of view (lack of technology). Have not thought about the % of people who might identify as the opposite gender but they would technically be male or female as you can't get surgery and magic is not widespread enough to duplicate it on a statistically significant scale. You might find a magic submarine for example but you can't get a fleet of them anyone who has transitioned would be via magic and be very rare almost unique. Mostly from ye olde Girdle that changes your gender.

Similar reason why nukes don't exist although there are similar ancient magitech versions hidden here and there. I don't have magical versions of most modern inventions except maybe as one of things in certain locations.

Zardnaar said:

As I said I looked at it in and its around 4-5% total. In the USA figures seem to be similar (3.8%). Bi sexual is less than 2%, gay is close to 3% so overall its a bit less than 1% total. The entire LGBT community here is just less than 5%. That is official/confidential census figures in one of the more liberal nations in the world. Sure not everyone might tick the box but its probably higher than 5%.

10% you can use but its around double official numbers from the most liberal nations on the planet. Also see this.
http://news.gallup.com/poll/183383/americans-greatly-overestimate-percent-gay-lesbian.aspx

Before I went digging a couple of sdays ago my estimate was around 3% so I was slightly off its more than I thought.

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If bisexuality was 2%, then probably things like prison sex, boarding school sex, and other samesex environments would be unheard of.

Objectively speaking, the human species seems more fluid than cultures like to pretend.

When there are various forms of persecution, discrimination, and social pressures, any statistics need caution.

When I was a kid, I remember when my (usually sane, intelligent) dad said, ‘There are no gay people in Norway’.

I laughed.

I told him, ‘Well, Norway legalized gay marriage, so there are at least two’.

Yaarel said:

If bisexuality was 2%, then probably things like prison sex, boarding school sex, and other samesex environments would be unheard of.

Objectively speaking, the human species seems more fluid than cultures like to pretend.

When there are various forms of persecution, discrimination, and social pressures, any statistics need caution.

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Somewhat extreme situations where members of the other sex are in limited supply lol.

As I said NZ is one of the best places in the world to be gay, beats me why they would need to hide it in a confidential government census where sexuality is expressly covered by our laws.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/lifestyle/news/article.cfm?c_id=6&objectid=11459271

Our numbers here are similar to the US numbers and I provided a link to show how people over estimate the amount of LBGT people in the general population.

LBGT are probably over represented in pop culture and in big cities which would skew the perception of how many there actually are. Gay people exist in my worlds, mass media does not. Trans basically do not exist in any significant numbers (due to technology)although if someone cared enough I would let them quest to enable it via magic I suppose. They would need to find a magical mc guffin or gain enough power and be a spellcaster and create their own spell to do it.

Zardnaar said:

Somewhat extreme situations where members of the other sex are in limited supply lol.

As I said NZ is one of the best places in the world to be gay, beats me why they would need to hide it in a confidential government census where sexuality is expressly covered by our laws.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/lifestyle/news/article.cfm?c_id=6&objectid=11459271

Our numbers here are similar to the US numbers and I provided a link to show how people over estimate the amount of LBGT people in the general population.

LBGT are probably over represented in pop culture and in big cities which would skew the perception of how many there actually are.

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Almost all other animals only have sex seasonally. Humans (and bonobos) are the only species who have sex whenever they want because of *social* cooperative survival strategies.

This biological revolution entails fluidity in sexual orientation. Indeed, bonobos are fully bisexual.

Human sexuality is a phenomenon that scientists are still investigating. It is fascinating.



In situations where the opposite sex is unavailable, it would be impossible for bisexuality to occur, unless humans were biologically bisexual.